Newark, Delaware Extension - SEPTA Connection

Discussion related to DC area passenger rail services from Northern Virginia to Baltimore, MD. Includes Light Rail and Baltimore Subway.

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MARC & SEPTA CONNECTION

Postby Bobby S » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:32 pm

What is the latest? Last I heard outlook was good. Meetings held...That this one MD "anti-rail guy" was coming around. Rail is there...Infrastructure is there...Stations can be easily built... BRAC is coming... Latest anyone??
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Postby gprimr1 » Mon Jul 30, 2007 7:06 pm

I work at MTA and I haven't heard any rumblings about it. SEPTA crews are qualified to Bacon Interlocking and MARC is qualified to somewhere near Perryville (someone know?) but again, this would require trainsets which are desperatly needed between Baltimore and DC.

Unfortunatly, in my opinion, MARC has far bigger issues than connecting with SEPTA. (We have people being denied boarding due to overcrowding.)
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Postby Murjax » Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:16 am

Ok, I don't know much about this issue but from what you posted, it doesn't sound like MARC would be willing to extend service to Newark, DE but what about SEPTA bringing service down to Perryville? Is that out of the question?
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Postby matthewsaggie » Sun Jan 06, 2008 10:29 pm

Show me the cash, and then someone will answer the question. No cash- no train.
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Postby Murjax » Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:06 am

Is it really that hard for them to do? They have the equipment and a line. How much money do they really need?
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Postby gprimr1 » Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:51 am

According to the MARC plan, MTA will reach Newark DE in 2015 and will be during peak service times only.
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Postby skm » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:22 pm

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Postby CHIP72 » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:02 pm

I know from reading an article in the Cecil Whig (Elkton's newspaper) about a year ago that Elkton really wants to see a train station built. I think their needs are higher going to Wilmington/Philadelphia than going to Baltimore/Washington (Cecil County is now classified as part of the Philadelphia metropolitan area for a reason), but obviously a train station could serve travelers in either direction.
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Postby skm » Thu Jan 24, 2008 8:11 am

Agreed.

My need from MH or Claymont would be to go south towards Balt/Wash, but the Philly/Wilmington trip would be beneficial to the increasing (but small) numbers of Md commuters on Septa's R2. I still see Md license plates in MH and Claymont RR lots.

In my part of Delaware County I work with several people from Elkton and even Hartford County.
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Newark, Delaware Extension - SEPTA Connection

Postby Amtrak7 » Wed May 21, 2008 5:01 pm

Marc plans to extend the Penn line to Newark, DE in 2012. It is a good move, as you will be able to go from New Haven to Washington without Amtrak. By offering weekend express service (Newark-BAL-BWI-WAS), they can lure many Amtrak riders, and thus generate more revenue.

Why doesn't Marc realize this?
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Postby CHIP72 » Wed May 21, 2008 8:45 pm

From talking with someone who works for MARC, I think part of the problem is they don't have their own crews; they rely on Amtrak (and CSX). Also, the state of Maryland would probably want the state of Delaware to pay for extending the service to the First State (ala what Delaware does with SEPTA R2 service).

I don't think operating to Newark is obvious; you're talking about going roughly 20 miles further than they already go for a small number of potential passengers (in part because there is no station in Elkton). Going to Wilmington (about another 15 miles beyond Newark) would make more sense than going to Newark.

Incidentally, I don't think there is any way MARC would run express from Newark to Baltimore without stopping in Aberdeen. Actually, I don't think MARC would have any service beyond Baltimore whenever they start having weekend service on that line.
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Postby realtype » Thu May 22, 2008 8:18 pm

I agree with you completely about the crew problem. I think MARC is large enough now to start thinking about having their own employees operate trains, like other rail services in the Northeast.

I don't think getting Delaware to pay will be a problem, nor will the relatively small number of passengers. Remeber MARC already has a successful contract with West Virginia (2 round trips daily+ 1 evening express) and the MARC trains headed to Martinsburg are the busiest and longest ones on the Brunswick Line. I would expect the number of commuters from DE to BALT/DC, plus the passengers from Elkton (where a station would definitely built before the extension), would be much greater than the number of riders from WV. I also would expect that the MARC Penn Line/SEPTA R2 would capture a significant share of PHIL/BALT/DC intercity trips, similar to the NJT/SEPTA share of NY/PHIL intercity trips. I don't think anybody has the time or patience to travel between New Haven and Washington solely by commuter rail. :-)

I am also pretty sure that MARC would not operate express service between Newark and Baltimore; local service between Newark and Baltimore then express service to DC is more likely.
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Postby polybalt » Fri May 23, 2008 4:41 pm

Years ago Delaware DOT was trying to get MARC to base the Perryville trains in Wilmington, since they could run in service to Perryville and on to Washington in the morning and the reverse in the afternoon. The mileage to Wilmington from Perryville is less than the deadhead mileage back to Baltimore, so they argued MARC would actually save money. They were NOT proposing to pay for the service!
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Postby Bobby S » Tue May 27, 2008 1:52 pm

There is going to be more ridership than one may think on this extension. Heading to Philly from Perryville with a stop in Elkton is something many commuters await. I will be one of them. And if/when this BRAC thing happens there should be even more demand.
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Postby spvanhart » Tue May 27, 2008 3:17 pm

I believe track capacity for one. A good portion of the track between Baltimore and Newark is only two track, including three river crossings. A second reason is probably money.
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