BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Discussion related to DC area passenger rail services from Northern Virginia to Baltimore, MD. Includes Light Rail and Baltimore Subway.

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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby SRich » Wed Mar 16, 2016 3:43 pm

The GM has made an good decision, to complete shutdown.

The question remains for how long? :wink:
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby JDC » Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:32 pm

SRich wrote:The GM has made an good decision, to complete shutdown.

The question remains for how long? :wink:


Metro is reopening Thursday, 5 AM.

Here is a press release, and a nifty video. http://www.wmata.com/about_metro/news/PressReleaseDetail.cfm?ReleaseID=6083. Metro found numerous areas where the cables/boots need to be replaced.
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby JDC » Wed Mar 16, 2016 6:10 pm

Metro posted a map, though sadly without a legend!, of where it has found issues with the cables. https://twitter.com/wmata/status/710238517180416000
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby JDC » Wed Mar 16, 2016 6:12 pm

WP story on the issues located during the shutdown, as well as the fact that USDOT is about to commence an inspections blitz of Metro, looking into red light running, misuse of handbrakes, and other issues. https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/trafficandcommuting/washington-braces-for-full-day-of-metro-shutdown-to-deal-with-safety-concerns/2016/03/16/42324598-eb3f-11e5-b0fd-073d5930a7b7_story.html
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby MCL1981 » Wed Mar 16, 2016 6:50 pm

Code: Select all
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Moderator's Note: Not sure what you were trying to post, MCL, but it didn't come through. Try again?
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby MBTA3247 » Wed Mar 16, 2016 9:41 pm

JDC wrote:WP story on the issues located during the shutdown, as well as the fact that USDOT is about to commence an inspections blitz of Metro, looking into red light running, misuse of handbrakes, and other issues. https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/trafficandcommuting/washington-braces-for-full-day-of-metro-shutdown-to-deal-with-safety-concerns/2016/03/16/42324598-eb3f-11e5-b0fd-073d5930a7b7_story.html

Red light running? I thought the Metro was automated?

Watching the video in that article, I noticed the jumper cables were bonded to the side of the third rail facing the running rails. That would seem like an inherent design flaw to me, since it leaves the cables vulnerable to being hit by passing trains if either the cable or part of the shoe assembly is out of alignment.
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby justalurker66 » Thu Mar 17, 2016 1:28 am

IIRC: WMATA has been running trains manually for the past few years. Not quite trusting their automation since the last passenger fatal accident.
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby MCL1981 » Thu Mar 17, 2016 4:32 am

Automatic vs manual has nothing at all to do with red/stop signals. ATP will stop the train at a red signal or zero speed command regardless of automatic or manual opertation. Then the operator would have to manually proceed past the red/stop signal with permission from OCC. Operating in manual mode since the 2009 crash is a PR smoke screen. It changes nothing. The crash in 2009 would have happened regardless because the failure is with the signalling system, not the person or computer pushing the throttle stick.
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Red Signa was: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours

Postby farecard » Thu Mar 17, 2016 6:24 am

MBTA3247 wrote: Red light running? I thought the Metro was automated?


WMATA has problems with rail operators disregarding red signals and proceeding anyhow. In some cases, this has tripped a derailer, in others not; but it all cases this is regarded as a major safety incident. The repetitive of this has shaped other safety decisions over time.
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby JDC » Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:07 am

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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby JDC » Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:14 am

JDC wrote:Metro posted a map, though sadly without a legend!, of where it has found issues with the cables. https://twitter.com/wmata/status/710238517180416000


Metro re-posted this map on its website with a press release and an explanation. http://www.wmata.com/about_metro/news/PressReleaseDetail.cfm?ReleaseID=6083
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby MCL1981 » Thu Mar 17, 2016 11:05 am

This needs to keep happening, probably on smaller scales, to get stuff fixed. If you need to close the entire red line for an entire weekend, and bring in 50 extra staff and contractors to fix all the fasteners and do a detailed inspection, do it. Then do the yellow line the next weekend. And so on. This fixing little bits and pieces for 3 hours per night is useless. It is falling apart faster than they're fixing it. And the whole thing needs to be INSPECTED in detail, end to end, to find what needs to be fixed. Obviously their inspections to date were useless. So start with a clean slate of detailed inspections, an work off of that.
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Re: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours, per reports

Postby MACTRAXX » Thu Mar 17, 2016 11:21 am

JDC wrote:I wonder what precedent this will set in terms of Metro tackling other system-wide issues during an entire system, or line, shutdown. For example, closing the entire Red Line for 24 hours over the weekend in order to clean the third rail, or insulators. Similarly, close the entire Yellow/Blue line in VA to clean right of way, etc. If the DC region can handle this with a few hours notice AND during a weekday, I can see this being something we could handle on a weekend during non-tourist season with lots of advance notice.


JDC, MCL and Everyone:

Metro needs to adopt a maintenance program similar to the NYCT FASTRACK in which a segment of line or if it is
necessary an entire line is shut down for an extended period of a weekend for crews to maintain infrastructure of
all types. Other lines remaining open - especially those in proximity - can operate with added service over these
scheduled time periods. EXAMPLE: Blue Line is closed from Friday PM until Monday AM between Stadium-Armory
and Largo Town Center with Blue Line trains operating over the Orange Line to New Carrollton.

Trunk lines through central Washington will be harder to close but with added alternate service on lines operating
should be able to manage handling a large percentage of weekend ridership and if necessary bus services could
be another alternative during weekends when they will be more readily available.

As we all noticed there were defective cables found by work crews during the one day 3/16 shutdown making
this all worthwhile despite the inconvenience to many riders and with a regularly scheduled maintenance program
hopefully something of this urgency will not have to happen again.

On a personal note this happens to be my 3000th post as a member of Railroad.net. I joined 11 years one month
and ten days ago with the object to contribute in a positive manner and to learn about rail transportation from the
wealth of knowledge of our membership which is one of the best features of these forums.

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Re: Red Signa was: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours

Postby Ridgefielder » Thu Mar 17, 2016 11:46 am

farecard wrote:
MBTA3247 wrote: Red light running? I thought the Metro was automated?


WMATA has problems with rail operators disregarding red signals and proceeding anyhow. In some cases, this has tripped a derailer, in others not; but it all cases this is regarded as a major safety incident. The repetitive of this has shaped other safety decisions over time.

Wait- what? How does the DC Metro not have automatic train stop devices at signals? "Trippers" have been standard on the NYC Subway since at least the 1940's. When a signal sets to "stop" a metal arm is raised from between or beside the rails; the rod will hit the "trip cock" that's mounted on each truck, which in turn shuts off the traction power and dumps the air.
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Re: Red Signa was: BREAKING: Metro to close for 24 hours

Postby MCL1981 » Thu Mar 17, 2016 2:20 pm

Ridgefielder wrote:Wait- what? How does the DC Metro not have automatic train stop devices at signals? "Trippers" have been standard on the NYC Subway since at least the 1940's. When a signal sets to "stop" a metal arm is raised from between or beside the rails; the rod will hit the "trip cock" that's mounted on each truck, which in turn shuts off the traction power and dumps the air.


They don't need them. It's automated as part of ATP. The train will stop itself when it encounters a zero speed command from ATC, which is also what a red signal would give it. The train will stop. You can't just chug along past a stop signal. Once the train is stopped, it can proceed again, limited automatically to 15mph, with permission from OCC. These signal violations seem to be mostly in yards, or misunderstanding legitimate orders to proceed past a stop signal.
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