M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.

Moderator: Liquidcamphor

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby DutchRailnut » Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:56 am

that really would be cost prohibitive. plus you never have your protect fleet were its needed on short term basis.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22128
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby BuddR32 » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:24 am

geico wrote:
DutchRailnut wrote:Even if they did the acceptance plan , you can be assured the cars will not go in service till a decent amount has been accepted.
no use putting them in equipment cycle if there is no spare equipment.


its called keeping the M3s only as a reserve fleet.


Keeping the M3s is already the plan, until the M9A purchase is well under way, but as to what Dutch is saying, having M3s wont help your spare ratio of enough accepted M9 cars to put them in regular revenue service. If you put the first six or 12 M9s in revenue service as soon as you have as many, you have no spare to account for cars that come O/S and need to be made whole. For example using six (or even eight) M9 cars, take one O/S you lose the whole drag, as whats left is too short to operate (not mechanically, just practically)
BuddR32
 
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2014 2:14 pm

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby geico » Thu Jan 17, 2019 8:05 am

12 M3s = reserve for 12 M9s
geico
 
Posts: 418
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2006 5:54 pm

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby BuddR32 » Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:27 am

geico wrote:12 M3s = reserve for 12 M9s

Yes, but back to what Dutch said about them being where they need to be. The M3s are a moot point in M9 acceptance anyway, as they're not going anywhere anytime soon.
BuddR32
 
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2014 2:14 pm

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby berlintransit » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:03 pm

Hello everybody,

a few weeks ago I came up with an updated listing for the M9 and M9A procurement contracts taken from LIRR Board Materials.
I mentioned the M9A contract has a provision for 30 'LIRR Option Coaches' - the purpose of which was discussed in this thread thereafter.

berlintransit wrote:[...]
3. The M9A procurement contract is planned to be awarded in the 2nd quarter of 2019 and will be segmented as followed:
    100 (up to) LIRR Base Cars
    114 LIRR Option Cars (60 planned M9A + 54 previously M9 Cars)
    214 Total regular LIRR Cars -- totalling to up to 416 with the M9, 180 for M3 replacement and up to 236 for ESA service and other service expansions
    30 LIRR Option Coaches -- more on that topic below
    244 Total Cars LIRR
    200 MNR Option Cars
    444 Total M9A Cars

Besides the expected regular 416 LIRR M9/M9A, there is a strange mention of 30 'LIRR Option Coaches'. I could not find out anything further about these mysterious coaches from older or more recent board meetings so far. For my understanding, a coach is a non-powered passenger car, a trailer. I have learned on Wiki the M9/M9A specification indeed seems to include something like a 'C' or single car with 114 seats compared to 111 and 101 in the A and B car.


I only just discovered that in the December LIRR Board meeting, the President Mr. Eng made comments allowing to assume that the 30 M9A option coaches are indeed intended for diesel operation.
Video: https://youtu.be/mVcCfYZ2SvA?t=3231 He talks about fleet enlargement, how he changed the M9A contract and then mentions provisions have been made for diesel cars in the contract.
From the written board minutes (http://web.mta.info/mta/news/books/pdf/190122_0930_LIRR.pdf):
In addition to the current Kawasaki orders for the M9, President Eng stated that he has directed staff to modify the M9A procurement to make the delivery schedule part of the best value process. Those proposers that can get us the cars the quickest and still deliver quality will be scored higher. He has also added diesel coaches to this procurement, as we know they are much needed on our branches that we have not yet been able to electrify. Our goal here is to provide the capacity to our customers on a regular basis so that we are not experiencing crowded trains [...].


If these plans go ahead, by 2023-2025 the LIRR will have the possibility to operate, I presume, up to five 6 car trains formed of these coaches on the Pt Jeff Branch. Capacity of such a train would be about 4.5 C3 cars so the five 4 car C3 sets operating on the Pt Jeff branch could be freed up for other purposes across the railroad. And as the DE/DM Loco fleet is scheduled to begin to be replaced at about the same time, it would be a good opportunity to purchase the additional units required to operate the M9A trailers.
berlintransit
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 2:36 pm

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby Jeff Smith » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:53 pm

Interesting. I would have assumed they’d be similar to the M8 MNRR unpowered trailers, restricted to riding between MU pairs. But if they’re converting them to regular coaches that’s going to involve more extensive changes.
Next stop, Willoughby
~Jeff Smith (fka "Sarge") :: RAILROAD.NET Site Administrator
Jeff Smith
Site Admin
 
Posts: 8137
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2006 9:28 am
Location: MP 67.2 Georgia Southern Railway

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby Jeff Smith » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:30 pm

Refresh my memory; will the 9’s have over and under running shoes like the M8’s?
Next stop, Willoughby
~Jeff Smith (fka "Sarge") :: RAILROAD.NET Site Administrator
Jeff Smith
Site Admin
 
Posts: 8137
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2006 9:28 am
Location: MP 67.2 Georgia Southern Railway

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby DutchRailnut » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:53 pm

why would they, they will never operate on MN .
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22128
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby Jeff Smith » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:21 pm

Why wouldn’t they? It was a joint procurement back then, even though indications are that MNRR won’t exercise its options. Single design may prove cheaper.
Next stop, Willoughby
~Jeff Smith (fka "Sarge") :: RAILROAD.NET Site Administrator
Jeff Smith
Site Admin
 
Posts: 8137
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2006 9:28 am
Location: MP 67.2 Georgia Southern Railway

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby Patch Hog » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:43 pm

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby Jeff Smith » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:21 pm
Why wouldn’t they? It was a joint procurement back then, even though indications are that MNRR won’t exercise its options. Single design may prove cheaper.

Every joint procurement has an addendum listing the differences between the two railroads.
This includes third rail collector arrangement on M9 which is overriding on LIRR.
Patch Hog
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2018 8:55 am

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby DutchRailnut » Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:51 pm

you be putting third rail shoes with a wear surface that will never get used , so for each third rail shoe you be chucking two pounds of unused cast iron ??
that makes no sense.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22128
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby BuddR32 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:18 am

Jeff Smith wrote:Refresh my memory; will the 9’s have over and under running shoes like the M8’s?


No they have the over riding shoes only.
BuddR32
 
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2014 2:14 pm

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby PlaneLoverA380 » Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:57 pm

Sorry, I've been busy school exams and didn't have time to post. I might be going out to catch the M9s the next time they come out.
As you leave the train, please step over the gap between the train and the platform

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCsBlYmAvw8pMUVupqsG3szw - My channel, I upload my railfanning catches here.
User avatar
PlaneLoverA380
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Wed May 02, 2018 2:04 pm
Location: Railfanning at Mineola

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby Head-end View » Fri Jan 25, 2019 7:34 pm

I cross the main-line every day and have yet to see one....... :(
Head-end View
 
Posts: 2603
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:00 pm
Location: The second row on a SEPTA Silverliner V

Re: M9 and M9A Procurement & Acceptance

Postby gregorygrice » Fri Jan 25, 2019 8:46 pm

They've been testing almost every night excluding weekends.
User avatar
gregorygrice
 
Posts: 1062
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2010 4:39 pm
Location: Queens, NY

PreviousNext

Return to Long Island Rail Road (LIRR)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: scopelliti and 6 guests