East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.

Moderator: Liquidcamphor

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby njt/mnrrbuff » Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:50 pm

Yes, that 5:09 train out of NYP on Fridays gets extremely packed. Remember, the only thing that is extra special to a railfan on the Cannonball is the drumhead on the nose of the locomotives. Other than that, the equipment is the same. Keep in mind that these trains that head to the East End have been known to have consistent delays because of overcrowdedness as a result of having to be spotted a few times at one station because many platforms on the Montauk Line can only handle six cars. The Cannonball during the peak season is 12 cars and even at 12 cars, the train is still extremely crowded.
njt/mnrrbuff
 
Posts: 3077
Joined: Thu Sep 30, 2004 9:33 pm

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby MACTRAXX » Thu Jun 28, 2018 4:37 pm

MACTRAXX wrote:Alkali: Trains 2708 (2:10pm Jamaica) 2798 (Friday Cannonball) and 2714 (5:09 pm Penn Station)
are likely the three busiest Montauk trains on a given Getaway Friday.


Everyone: Friday June 29th could be the busiest Getaway Friday this Summer 2018 season.
With July 4th falling on a Wednesday this may possibly spread out Getaway Holiday
riders somewhat instead of the busiest period peaking on Friday afternoon...

With Labor Day early this year: Monday September 3rd-that Getaway Friday will be the last day of
August-the 31st. The July Fourth and Labor Day holidays are traditionally the busiest holidays for
the LIRR East End and Beach Getaway services over the course of the Summer season.

Both tomorrow and Friday August 31 will be very busy days for LIRR ticket offices and TVMs with
the end of the month and week right along with these two days being big Getaway Fridays.

With a long stretch of hot weather in store to end June and begin July this will only increase the
interest in the upcoming LIRR Friday Getaway and Beach Getaway services...MACTRAXX
EXPRESS TRAIN TO NEW YORK PENN STATION-NO JAMAICA ON THIS TRAIN-PLEASE STAND CLEAR OF THE CLOSING TRAIN DOORS
MACTRAXX
 
Posts: 3841
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:55 am
Location: Islandia,Long Island,NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby DaveBarraza » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:02 pm

EB Equipment move for the second Greenport scoot had 3 cars today
User avatar
DaveBarraza
 
Posts: 283
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:52 pm
Location: Out Past Ronkonkoma, NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby MACTRAXX » Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:40 am

DB: The Greenport Scoot equipment assignment may change twice this week - there will be two
evening trains running on Tuesday July 3rd. Three cars is likely due to the July 4 holiday period.

There has been mention of two car trains running to Oyster Bay - as most know two cars is the
usual Greenport Scoot trainset especially recently with the increase in Ronkonkoma-Greenport
service. Traditionally three cars are assigned during busier travel periods such as this one.

Everyone: Video of Friday June 29th Cannonball arrival at Westhampton. The sizable number of
passengers exiting the train and the resulting parking lot traffic speaks for itself:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TzKUCQlr28
For the record (from an ETT) Westhampton is 74.3 miles from Long Island City.
Speonk is 71.4 - the distance between SK and WH is 2.9 miles.
Cannonball station mileages from LIC:
Southampton 89.3
Bridgehampton 94.5
East Hampton 100.9
Westhampton to Montauk 115.8 is 41.5 miles.

Westhampton to Montauk in Zone 14 is the longest distance between two stations in any LIRR
fare zone - the minimum intermediate station fare of $3.25 prepaid will cover this ride.
MACTRAXX
EXPRESS TRAIN TO NEW YORK PENN STATION-NO JAMAICA ON THIS TRAIN-PLEASE STAND CLEAR OF THE CLOSING TRAIN DOORS
MACTRAXX
 
Posts: 3841
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:55 am
Location: Islandia,Long Island,NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby R36 Combine Coach » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:23 pm

MACTRAXX wrote:Westhampton to Montauk in Zone 14 is the longest distance between two stations in any LIRR
fare zone - the minimum intermediate station fare of $3.25 prepaid will cover this ride.
41 miles for $3.25, perhaps the best deal in commuter rail (on NJT $3.00 will get you a ride on the Dinky, $2.75 for a local fare on the New Canaan Branch).
Since my friend continues to chain smoke nonstop, she is probably an Alco.
User avatar
R36 Combine Coach
 
Posts: 5203
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby DaveBarraza » Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:17 pm

Just noticed that 8711 runs through to Hunterspoint Ave, and possibly Long Island City as well.

Is this a permanent (summer permanent) thing?

Montauk Branch Customers
Delays Posted: 07/01/2018 6:06PM


Westbound:

The 3:30PM train from Montauk due Jamaica at 6:15PM is operating 30 minutes late due to late-arriving equipment. We apologize for the inconvenience.

The 4:00PM train from Montauk due Long Island City at 7:15PM is operating 13 minutes late due to a late train ahead.
User avatar
DaveBarraza
 
Posts: 283
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:52 pm
Location: Out Past Ronkonkoma, NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby MACTRAXX » Sun Jul 01, 2018 10:12 pm

DB: From checking the current Montauk Branch timetable #8711 stops at Hunterspoint Avenue at
7:00 pm - the only weekend train showing an HPA stop - making the LIC time of 7:15 likely to be
correct even though there is no LIC stop mention in the timetable. Since HPA is a discharge only
stop they may not wait at HPA even though the schedule allows for 15 minutes to go the single
mile between HPA and LIC if the train is running early. What is a surprise to me is scheduling a
long time period similar to eastbound trains that are receiving passengers at both HPA and LIC
when that time length westbound between these stations is not really necessary. MACTRAXX
EXPRESS TRAIN TO NEW YORK PENN STATION-NO JAMAICA ON THIS TRAIN-PLEASE STAND CLEAR OF THE CLOSING TRAIN DOORS
MACTRAXX
 
Posts: 3841
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:55 am
Location: Islandia,Long Island,NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby MACTRAXX » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:13 pm

R36 Combine Coach wrote:
MACTRAXX wrote:Westhampton to Montauk in Zone 14 is the longest distance between two stations in any LIRR
fare zone - the minimum intermediate station fare of $3.25 prepaid will cover this ride.
41 miles for $3.25, perhaps the best deal in commuter rail (on NJT $3.00 will get you a ride on the Dinky, $2.75 for a local fare on the New Canaan Branch).


R36: Some other East End and other fare mentions that I have taken notice to:

The 41.5 mile distance between Westhampton and Montauk is almost double the 21 miles on the
Greenport Scoot between Riverhead and Greenport (73.3 to 94.3 miles from LIC) which are the
west and east stations in Zone 14 on the Main Line.

There is a very extreme differential in distance on the Montauk Branch that exists between Zone
14 and Zone 12 to the west for the same $6.25 prepaid station fare: The short ride of 2.9 miles
between Speonk and Westhampton and the long ride of exactly 58 miles between Bellport and
Montauk (57.8 to 115.8 miles from LIC). Another fact I took notice to is that Bellport is almost
at the exact halfway point between LIC and Montauk which is only off by two tenths of a mile.

With the 2017 fare increase the LIRR increased the cost of the minimum intermediate zone fare
25 cents to $3.25 while the MNCR NY minimum fare remained at $3 and the CT minimum fare
which also remained at $2.75. That fare from New Canaan extends as far west as Greenwich
(13 miles - mile 41 to 28 from GCT) which is between neighboring NH Line fare zones.

With the mention of $3 to ride the Princeton Dinky 2.8 miles I will also mention one short LIRR
ride that is quite expensive since it is between Zones 1 and 3 which is 1.6 miles between Kew
Gardens and Jamaica (7.7 to 9.3 miles from LIC) in which one way prepaid station fares are:
$10.25 Peak and $7.50 Off Peak. The higher peak fare applies during AM Peak westbound and
PM Peak eastbound (6-10 AM and 4-8 PM respectively on weekdays) along with the $4.25 City
Ticket fare applying on Saturday and Sunday.

Fare anomalies such as these can be very interesting to know about...MACTRAXX
EXPRESS TRAIN TO NEW YORK PENN STATION-NO JAMAICA ON THIS TRAIN-PLEASE STAND CLEAR OF THE CLOSING TRAIN DOORS
MACTRAXX
 
Posts: 3841
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:55 am
Location: Islandia,Long Island,NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby R36 Combine Coach » Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:59 am

MACTRAXX wrote:I will also mention one short LIRR ride that is quite expensive since it is between Zones 1 and 3 which is 1.6 miles between Kew
Gardens and Jamaica (7.7 to 9.3 miles from LIC) in which one way prepaid station fares are: $10.25 Peak and $7.50 Off Peak.
Flushing Main Street to Willets Point (zone 1-3) is the same and very short distance (one stop on the 7 Train or 20 minute walk). I recall intermediate local fares in Nassau/Suffolk counties are kept low for certain reasons, much like ConnDOT local fares are for intrastate CT travel.

Of course perhaps the best value is the NJT RiverLine: the entire line for a base 1-zone local bus fare.
Since my friend continues to chain smoke nonstop, she is probably an Alco.
User avatar
R36 Combine Coach
 
Posts: 5203
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby MACTRAXX » Mon Jul 02, 2018 6:14 am

R36 Combine Coach wrote:
MACTRAXX wrote:I will also mention one short LIRR ride that is quite expensive since it is between Zones 1 and 3 which is 1.6 miles between Kew
Gardens and Jamaica (7.7 to 9.3 miles from LIC) in which one way prepaid station fares are: $10.25 Peak and $7.50 Off Peak.
Flushing Main Street to Willets Point (zone 1-3) is the same and very short distance (one stop on the 7 Train or 20 minute walk). I recall intermediate local fares in Nassau/Suffolk counties are kept low for certain reasons, much like ConnDOT local fares are for intrastate CT travel.

Of course perhaps the best value is the NJT RiverLine: the entire line for a base 1-zone local bus fare.


R36: Going off topic somewhat to reply about fares on the LIRR and elsewhere:

1-Yes. The shortest possible Zone 1-3 ride is between Mets-Willets Point and Flushing Main Street.
0.8 of a mile is the distance (6.7 to 7.5 miles from LIC). The Port Washington Branch has the most
expensive fares on the LIRR on a mile to mile basis thanks to crossing between three fare zones
1-3-4 and the Queens-Nassau line between Little Neck and Great Neck. PW is 18.1 miles from LIC.

2-The intermediate same or neighboring zone $3.25 fare applies between Zones 4-7-9-10 and 12.
For the record Zones 4 and 7 cover Nassau County - Zones 9 to 14 cover Suffolk County.

Two good examples of long $3.25 rides in Suffolk County are:
Montauk Branch: Bay Shore to Speonk (Zone 10-12; Mile 40.7 to 71.4 from LIC - 30.7 miles)
Port Jefferson Branch: Cold Spring Harbor to Port Jefferson (Zone 9-10; Mile 31.9 to 57.4 from
LIC - 25.3 miles). These two are the second and third longest possible minimum fare rides on the
LIRR behind the previously mentioned Zone 14 Westhampton-Montauk (41.5 miles) fare.

3-The 33 mile ride from Trenton to Camden on the NJT River Line for $1.75 is one of the better
bargains offered anyplace in the NJ-NY region. The low RL fare was originally implemented as a
introductory fare which ended up becoming permanent.

In closing there are so many interesting variables in fares that can be found...MACTRAXX
EXPRESS TRAIN TO NEW YORK PENN STATION-NO JAMAICA ON THIS TRAIN-PLEASE STAND CLEAR OF THE CLOSING TRAIN DOORS
MACTRAXX
 
Posts: 3841
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:55 am
Location: Islandia,Long Island,NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby gamer4616 » Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:34 am

MACTRAXX wrote:DB: From checking the current Montauk Branch timetable #8711 stops at Hunterspoint Avenue at
7:00 pm - the only weekend train showing an HPA stop - making the LIC time of 7:15 likely to be
correct even though there is no LIC stop mention in the timetable. Since HPA is a discharge only
stop they may not wait at HPA even though the schedule allows for 15 minutes to go the single
mile between HPA and LIC if the train is running early. What is a surprise to me is scheduling a
long time period similar to eastbound trains that are receiving passengers at both HPA and LIC
when that time length westbound between these stations is not really necessary. MACTRAXX



8711 makes a passenger stop at LIC. The running time is needed as a crew member has to walk across Borden Ave and operate the crossing gates manually. They will lower and raise the gates, for both Borden Ave and 11th St crossings. The crew also has to throw switches in the yard, making sure they access a station track.
gamer4616
 
Posts: 37
Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2016 6:49 pm

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby DaveBarraza » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:08 pm

gamer4616 wrote:
MACTRAXX wrote:DB: From checking the current Montauk Branch timetable #8711 stops at Hunterspoint Avenue at
7:00 pm - the only weekend train showing an HPA stop - making the LIC time of 7:15 likely to be
correct even though there is no LIC stop mention in the timetable. Since HPA is a discharge only
stop they may not wait at HPA even though the schedule allows for 15 minutes to go the single
mile between HPA and LIC if the train is running early. What is a surprise to me is scheduling a
long time period similar to eastbound trains that are receiving passengers at both HPA and LIC
when that time length westbound between these stations is not really necessary. MACTRAXX


8711 makes a passenger stop at LIC. The running time is needed as a crew member has to walk across Borden Ave and operate the crossing gates manually. They will lower and raise the gates, for both Borden Ave and 11th St crossings. The crew also has to throw switches in the yard, making sure they access a station track.



Thanks!
User avatar
DaveBarraza
 
Posts: 283
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:52 pm
Location: Out Past Ronkonkoma, NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby MACTRAXX » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:00 pm

Gamer: I will second DB and thank you for this information about going into LIC from HPA.

With #8711 the only weekend train stopping at HPA it would make more sense to get off there
instead of waiting through the time-consuming moves necessary to ride to the LIC terminal.

Does the LIRR have any idea about how many passengers ride to HPA (and LIC especially)
on train #8711?
MACTRAXX
EXPRESS TRAIN TO NEW YORK PENN STATION-NO JAMAICA ON THIS TRAIN-PLEASE STAND CLEAR OF THE CLOSING TRAIN DOORS
MACTRAXX
 
Posts: 3841
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:55 am
Location: Islandia,Long Island,NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby DaveBarraza » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:37 pm

MACTRAXX wrote:Does the LIRR have any idea about how many passengers ride to HPA (and LIC especially)
on train #8711?
MACTRAXX


Play your cards right, and you can be the first one !!!!! 8-D
User avatar
DaveBarraza
 
Posts: 283
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:52 pm
Location: Out Past Ronkonkoma, NY

Re: East End Service: Greenport Scoot, Montauk Line, Etc.

Postby SPEONKNY » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:42 pm

njt/mnrrbuff wrote:Yes, that 5:09 train out of NYP on Fridays gets extremely packed. Remember, the only thing that is extra special to a railfan on the Cannonball is the drumhead on the nose of the locomotives. Other than that, the equipment is the same. Keep in mind that these trains that head to the East End have been known to have consistent delays because of overcrowdedness as a result of having to be spotted a few times at one station because many platforms on the Montauk Line can only handle six cars. The Cannonball during the peak season is 12 cars and even at 12 cars, the train is still extremely crowded.

All Hampton's trains Friday E/B and Sunday W/B are overcrowded and the short platforms have nothing to do with that. I was at Jamaica yesterday (FRI) around 5 pm and some customers were unable to board the 4:49 Montauk bound train that had originated at Hunterspoint. That train was packed with standees all the way past Patchogue. Why would you want to run a 4-car set all the way from City Zone/Jamaica to Montauk at 5 pm on a summer Friday?
SPEONKNY
 
Posts: 23
Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:51 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Long Island Rail Road (LIRR)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests