California High-Speed Rail (CAHSR) System

Discussion related to commuter rail and transit operators in California past and present including Los Angeles Metrolink and Metro Subway and Light Rail, San Diego Coaster, Sprinter and MTS Trolley, Altamont Commuter Express (Stockton), Caltrain and MUNI (San Francisco), Sacramento RTD Light Rail, and others...

Moderator: lensovet

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby ExCon90 » Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:08 pm

I think any possibility of achieving higher speeds would be negated by the number of slots taken up by Metrolink and Coaster, which, as electricron points out, are non-electrified and likely to remain so. The whole operation would be a classic example of the difficulty of interweaving locals and expresses on a double-track line while providing a clockface (hourly, or half-hourly?) schedule for the expresses. And before somebody points out that they do it in Europe all the time, let it be noted that it requires two through and two station tracks at the local stations--like Bayshore and Lawrence on Caltrain (just imagine the reaction in Encinitas!)--plus an on-time culture that has not reached these shores.
ExCon90
 
Posts: 3989
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:22 pm

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby electricron » Wed Oct 25, 2017 7:56 am

New cost estimations for the San Jose to Madera sector through the Pacheco Pass.
http://www.latimes.com/local/california ... story.html
"When the first California bullet train pulls out of San Jose one day, a crucial part of the journey will be a 13.5-mile tunnel beneath the winding peaks and valleys of Pacheco Pass.
Bent Flyvbjerg, a University of Oxford professor who has studied high-speed rail projects around the world, estimated the cost could range from $5.6 billion (with a 50% chance of a cost overrun) to $14.6 billion (with a 20% chance of a cost overrun).
An executive at one of the nation’s leading engineering firms, who was not authorized to publicly comment on the state rail plan but is knowledgeable about the project, estimated the cost would run from $10 billion to $12 billion, based on recent experience with long tunnels in difficult geology.
Herbert Einstein, an MIT civil engineer and expert on tunnel construction, put the cost at roughly $6 billion — saying that was on the low side, based on his experience in other projects."

And that's not the only place CHSR will have to tunnel, there's potentially 36 miles of tunnels under the Southern California mountains as well.
electricron
 
Posts: 4426
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:35 pm

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby kaitoku » Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:20 am

DB confirmed as early train operator:
The California High-Speed Rail Authority (CHSRA) has confirmed that DB Engineering and Consulting has been awarded an early train operator services contract to assist with the United State’s first high-speed railway.
The announcement comes a month after CHSRA ranked the consortium – which consists of DB, Alternate Concepts, and HDR – above three rival bids in the race to secure the deal.

https://www.globalrailnews.com/2017/11/ ... peed-rail/
kaitoku
 
Posts: 516
Joined: Fri May 08, 2009 9:26 pm
Location: Sapporo, Japan

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby David Benton » Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:23 am

Talk about putting the cart before the donkey , but I guess it was something they could do without spending much money.
Moderator worldwide railfan , Rail travel & trip reports
The only train trips I regret are the ones I didn't take.
User avatar
David Benton
 
Posts: 8299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:29 pm
Location: New Zealand

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby deathtopumpkins » Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:23 am

Not really putting the cart before the horse/donkey. It's important to have the future operator's input in designing what they're going to be running. DB knows what they're doing with HSR, so they can help the CHSRA with final design to ensure the system will run smoothly once ready for service.
Call me Connor or DTP

Railfan & Roadgeek from the North Shore of Mass.
deathtopumpkins
 
Posts: 1035
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:56 am
Location: Somerville, MA

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby lensovet » Sun Nov 19, 2017 2:01 am

my thoughts exactly
Paul Borokhov

Last RRPicArch addition – NJ Railfan.

NJT RailCalifornia commuter (mod)
User avatar
lensovet
 
Posts: 1036
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:30 pm
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby Gilbert B Norman » Mon Jul 30, 2018 1:20 pm

Today, it's The Times turn to "tee-off":

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/30/us/c ... -rail.html

Fair Use:

.FRESNO, Calif. — It is vigorously opposed by Republicans, including President Trump. It has been plagued by escalating costs and delays. Californians are mostly against it. And a central question — how is it going to be paid for — remains unresolved.

But here in the Central Valley, far from the debates in Washington and Sacramento, the $100 billion Los Angeles-to-San Francisco bullet train has moved off the drawing board and onto 21 construction sites spread across five Central California counties.

Work began two weeks ago on one of the more ambitious pieces of the project — an overpass that will carry trains over a major highway in Fresno — and ground will be broken on three more viaducts in the next few months. Nearly 2,000 workers are on the job, starting as early as 5 a.m. to avoid the 110-degree afternoon heat. “Simply put, dirt is flying in the Central Valley,” the High-Speed Rail Authority declared in a recent business plan.

Yet for all the cranes, crews in orange vests, beeping trucks and fresh concrete, it remains far from certain that this project will ever be completed. In addition to the lack of funding, it faces opposition from both Mr. Trump and Kevin McCarthy, the Bakersfield Republican who is the House majority leader.


While this is an article which represents reporting by a news organization that I believe carefully distinguishes between such and opinion, the article sets a negative tone for the completion of such and if completed the value of the transportation provided in relation to its cost.
Gilbert B Norman
 
Posts: 13643
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:52 am
Location: Clarendon Hills, IL (BNSF Chicago Sub; MP 18.71)

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby John_Perkowski » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:12 pm

For my native state to receive funding on this, it will take a Democratic Congress and a Democratic President.
~John Perkowski: Moderator: General Discussion: Locomotives, Rolling Stock, and Equipment
Assistant Administrator: Railroad.net/forums
Please don't feed the spammers! If you see spam, please notify a Moderator
User avatar
John_Perkowski
 
Posts: 4711
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 5:12 pm
Location: Off the Q main near Parkville MO

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby mtuandrew » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:28 pm

John_Perkowski wrote:For my native state to receive funding on this, it will take a Democratic Congress and a Democratic President.

I agree on the D Congress (both houses), but Trump seems happy to put pen to paper as long as he can profit in either reputation or currency. Secy Chao has a vested interest in big American construction projects, and happens to know a certain powerful senator who could help shepherd a bill if it does benefit conservatives as well.
User avatar
mtuandrew
 
Posts: 5264
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:59 am
Location: the Manassas Gap Independent Line

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby gokeefe » Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:41 pm

California is committed ... They're going to fund it themselves if they have to ...
gokeefe
User avatar
gokeefe
 
Posts: 11091
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:28 pm
Location: Winthrop, Maine

Re: CA California CAHSR System

Postby lensovet » Tue Jul 31, 2018 4:53 am

great pictures but i struggle to make sense of commentary like this:

For all the construction, the project faces the ever-present threat that a future governor may decide that state resources would be better used dealing with, to name one example, the housing crisis


how, pray tell, will the government solve the housing crisis? what funds, that were destined for this project, could be redirected for such a purpose, and how would they be spent?
Paul Borokhov

Last RRPicArch addition – NJ Railfan.

NJT RailCalifornia commuter (mod)
User avatar
lensovet
 
Posts: 1036
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:30 pm
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: California High-Speed Rail (CAHSR) System

Postby tomj » Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:49 pm

I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and this state needs a far more expansive rail network. I want high speed, but we also need a network that has trans weaving their way around the state where 100 mph is normal instead of a distant dream. Hell getting 5,000 miles of upgraded track could be done for less than what we are spending to get our roads back up to deficient. But funding a state wide Amtrak style system would take more money than the state could ever hope to raise. So we are stuck with ill planned projects like this. Never mind our housing crisis, outrageous utilities, and moronically complicated local government structure.
tomj
 
Posts: 52
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:06 pm

CA HSR Status

Postby lpetrich » Sun Oct 28, 2018 6:41 am

Sources: California High Speed Rail Authority - State of California and BuildHSR | California High-Speed Rail Authority ("Build High-Speed Rail")

The first construction to be done is divided into Construction Packages 1 to 4.

CP 1: Ave. 19 north of Madera to E. American Ave. south of Fresno.
32 miles, 12 grade separations, 2 viaducts, 1 tunnel, 1 river crossing (the San Joaquin River)
Design-build Contract: 2013 August

CP 2-3: E. American Ave. to 1 mile north of the Tulare/Kern county line.
60 miles, 36 grade separations
Design-build Contract: 2015 June

CP 4: Tulare/Kern to Poplar Avenue north of Shafter.
22 miles, some embankments and viaducts, relocation of 4 miles of BNSF track
Design-build Contract: 2016 February

Of these, the first one is the farthest along, with some parts complete or close to complete. The others are also under construction, with a total of 114 route miles.

The latest news: High-Speed Rail Authority Board of Directors Approves Alignment within Fresno to Bakersfield Project Section Certifies Final Supplemental Environmental Impact Report with Final Supplemental Environmental Impact Report/Statement: Fresno to Bakersfield Project Section | California High-Speed Rail Authority.
That segment will be 23 miles long, and it will go almost due east from Shafter to Hwy. 99 and then along that highway to a station on F Street in Bakersfield.
lpetrich
 
Posts: 1228
Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 2:09 pm

Re: CA HSR Status

Postby lpetrich » Sun Oct 28, 2018 2:03 pm

From the 2016 Business Plan at the main CHSRA site, has a list of expected environmental-assessment completion dates (document page 88, PDF page 98). In the page before it, for the Central Valley Wye, "Final environmental clearance is anticipated in spring 2019." The wye will extend from Madera to Merced.

Also in 2019, San Jose - CV Wye, Bakersfield - Palmdale, Burbank - Los Angeles - Anaheim. In 2020, San Francisco - San Jose, Palmdale - Burbank.

From page 17 / 27, they continue to propose making Silicon Valley - Central Valley first. But they extend it from San Jose - Poplar Ave. to San Francisco - Bakersfield. They also propose building San Francisco - Gilroy before the Pacheco Pass tunnels and Madera - Merced.

They plan this approach:
1. Complete Central Valley civil work
2. Add Central Valley track and systems
3. Expand Central Valley construction -- Poplar Ave. to Bakersfield
4. Expand electrification of the Caltrain corridor -- from San Jose to Gilroy
5. Make additional capital investments from San José to San Francisco
6. Advance Pacheco Pass and Merced project development work
7. Engage with partners -- about building the tunnels

They will consider two options for putting the Central Valley trackage to use: (1) improved San Joaquin service and (2) early high-speed service. I think that I'd like the latter, because it would be a good way to show that there is something. I remember reading that some critics snicker that the HSR construction will become a latter-day Stonehenge.

The Madera - Bakersfield track distance is around 137 miles, and an average speed of 150 mph gives a bit less than an hour of travel time. However, it is 3 times faster than Amtrak's San Joaquins. That train's connecting buses to Los Angeles take about 2h 20m, and a Madera - San Jose bus will likely take a similar amount of time to make its trip. The San Joaquins with their Oakland - San Francisco bus take 4 hours to do SF - Madera, even longer. Thus giving a rather disjointed trip.
lpetrich
 
Posts: 1228
Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 2:09 pm

Re: California High-Speed Rail (CAHSR) System

Postby Herring » Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:32 pm

Gov. Newsom Abandons Plan for High-Speed Train From L.A. to San Francisco, Cites Cost

"California Gov. Gavin Newsom announced Tuesday he's abandoning a plan to build a high-speed rail line between Los Angeles and San Francisco, a project with an estimated cost that has ballooned to $77 billion.
"Let's be real," Newsom said in his first State of the State address. "The current project, as planned, would cost too much and respectfully take too long. There's been too little oversight and not enough transparency.""
Newsom, though, said he wants to finish construction that's already under way on a segment of the high-speed train through California's Central Valley, arguing it will revitalize the economically depressed region. He's also replacing Brown's head of the state board that oversees the project and pledged more accountability for contractors that run over on costs."
Herring
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2005 5:24 am

PreviousNext

Return to California Commuter & Transit

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest