NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Discussion related to New York, Susquehanna & Western operations past and present. Also includes some discussion related to Deleware Otsego owned and operated shortlines. Official web site can be found here: NYSW.COM.

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NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby budd5670 » Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:38 pm

Whats the best time of day/day of the week to catch NYSW Utica to Sangerfeild, and also is that train still symboled UT-1??

Also, what scanner frequency is NYSW on the northern branch??
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby Mark Wengert » Wed Dec 25, 2013 6:44 pm

I caught it at stone rd in Cassville at 1:35 last wednesday heading to Sangersfield and at 4:30 same place returning. Not sure if that is the normal but my dad lives right there and was visiting him most of the day, so I got lucky for once.
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:19 pm

Same question, but any more recent info? ANy regular days/times to Sangerfield?

Also, does UT-1 reliably traverse Schuyler St. 5 days a week, or is even the Utica-area local work less frequent/predictable than that? I assume they are normally on duty at some normal hour (i.e., 6-9 am) of the morning on days they run?
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby ut-1 » Thu Feb 26, 2015 7:41 am

There is almost always daily activity M-F on Schuyler St., whether the crew heads to Sangerfield or not. Usually, there is one daily round trip Utica to Sangerfield; however, of late, sometimes the crew will spend an entire day servicing customers in New Hartford/New York Mills & doing work in the Utica yard.

I can only remember one occasion in recent years when a crew was called out on a Saturday

When they do head south to Sangerfield, they usually cross Genesee St in S. Utica between 10-12. They almost always return between 4-5.

So, then, generally: activity on Schuyler Street usually occurs M-F between 10-12 and 4-5.
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Thu Feb 26, 2015 4:44 pm

Ok, thanks! The one and only time I've ever seen UT-1 working, 2 years ago, it was somewhere in the 9-11AM frame when they went south down Schuyler street and then out to NY Mills. Glad to hear they run at least somewhere local pretty much every day on weekdays.
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Sat Mar 07, 2015 10:35 pm

Just to clarify, since I had previously been under the impression that runs all the way to Sangerfield were unpredictable/only a couple times per week... you're saying that they, more often than not/on most days, DO go all the way to Sangerfield... but on -some- days they periodically do not?
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby Alek9997 » Sun Mar 08, 2015 8:03 am

They run South to Sangerfield more often in the spring than in the winter, due to the fertilizer rush and the growing season starting up.

How often I can't say exactly but during peak (Late March, April, early May), multiple times per week. I'd say your best bet is later in the work week (Wednesday, Thursday, Friday). Like ut-1 said, Weekends are usually pretty quiet.

Hope this helps ..
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Sun Mar 08, 2015 5:14 pm

Thanks Alek!
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Thu Mar 26, 2015 5:48 pm

I caught UT-1 2 day last week, Didn't go to Sangerfield either day, just Oneida Warehouse one day and some other work on the ex DL&W and west shore the second day. Crew said they only go to Sangerfield once, maybe twice a week but will e more starting in a few weeks for fertilizer.

Timing was about as has been reported elsewhere, although Fri. Am they were already heading down Schuyler St around 8:30 AM.

A question:

Is the branch to Oneida Warehouse (just the short spur off the former O&W Utica main) historic O&W trackage, post-O&W construction, or trackage of another RR spliced into the O&W? I would at face value assume it was a historically O&W spur, but have to wonder if with the more modern highway construction in the immediate vicinity, if it might have been originally configured differently and/or reached from somewhere other than the current switch off the O&W. I suspect that at least some trackage in the vicinity of the modern day RT 8/12 corridor and interchange has been shifted around a bit to accomodate the highway construction/widening/ realignments/interchanges etc.
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby Alek9997 » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:56 am

OIBU -

Yes, the spur to present-day Oneida Warehouse is indeed an O&W-era Branch! It was accessed how it is now, from the switch off the main over by Wilbur Road.

On the other end, it ran further than it does now, along Campion Road for a few hundred feet where it turned to the West and crossed Campion Road and to American Emblem Company which was in the Vicinity of what's now the "Kid's Fun Zone" along Genesee Street (Across from the Nice 'N' Easy Station just south of the Route 8 overpass).

When it was cut back to Mohawk Containers (Now Oneida Warehouse), I am not sure. American Emblem shut down in 1964, by which point the industrial spur was under the control of Erie Lackawanna. But I'm pretty sure American Emblem was off the roster even quite a while before then, because a 1960 IDD map I have showing the customers along the EL in Utica (Including the ones on the ex-O&W acquired by the DL&W after the former went out in 1957) shows the line not going further than Carparelli & Sons. Last I looked, some of those rails were still in place in the tarmac there.

If someone can provide corrections or more info please do so.

~Alek Salka
Last edited by Alek9997 on Fri Mar 27, 2015 4:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby ut-1 » Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:34 am

Good answer, Alek. Also, there was a spur off the spur, if you will, to behind the old Sears store in the New Hartford Shopping Center. A section of track was still visible through the blacktop a few years ago.
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby Alek9997 » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:14 am

ut-1 wrote:Good answer, Alek. Also, there was a spur off the spur, if you will, to behind the old Sears store in the New Hartford Shopping Center. A section of track was still visible through the blacktop a few years ago.


UT-1, Thanks for verifying that, I did notice what appeared to be the outline of a spur there, along the edge of the parking lot by the Golfing store, but I was unaware if it really was a spur or not. It wasn't there during the O&W days, though, Nor was it listed as an EL customer on the 1960 IDD map I mentioned above. I suspect it was built long after the Shopping Center was, which was in the late 1950's.

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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:48 am

Thanks guys! There is sure a fascinating history, and a fascinating amount of remaining bits and pieces, in that area. I'm a bit of an O&W foamer so I was curious to know if that was actually O&W to Oneida WH and if there was any more to it than that, so you gave a great explanation. Makes me wish I'd ever had the chance to see the 116 on that trackage!
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby Alek9997 » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:53 am

oibu wrote:Thanks guys! There is sure a fascinating history, and a fascinating amount of remaining bits and pieces, in that area. I'm a bit of an O&W foamer so I was curious to know if that was actually O&W to Oneida WH and if there was any more to it than that, so you gave a great explanation. Makes me wish I'd ever had the chance to see the 116 on that trackage!


No problem.

And yes, NYOW 116 did make the trek over there more than once during it's time on the NYS&W, just as it had when it was operating under the real O&W half a century prior.

Alek S
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Re: NYSW Utica-Sangerfield Schedule (UT-1)

Postby oibu » Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:21 pm

One other thing I was just looking at: I believe the I.T. to NY Mills was former West SHore trackage, but looking at aerial photos I see that the WEst SHore mainline actually went west toward Clark Mills from the area of the DL&W/WEst shore/O&W jct. along RT 8 in NEw Hartford (i.e., westward just south of the NYSDOT shop), not north through NY Mills toward Yorkville/Whitestown along the northeast side of the NYSDOT yard. So was this in fact West SHore, and if so where did it go? - just serving local industry as a branch, or I'm guessing maybe it connected to the NYC mainlin around Yorkville/Whitestown? Or am I missing something?
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