West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.

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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby newpylong » Sun May 15, 2016 5:41 am

Mikejf wrote:I had heard 14 cars on the ground, blocking both mains. Probably just an estimate. Wondering if this was an area of a pull apart when it was so cold, and now so warm the rail has expanded...


It's single track there...
Last edited by newpylong on Sun May 15, 2016 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby Mikejf » Sun May 15, 2016 6:45 am

Thanks Newpy for the correction. Only repeating what I was told, not all that familiar with that section out there
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby johnpbarlow » Sun May 15, 2016 8:12 am

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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby neman2 » Sun May 15, 2016 9:01 am

johnpbarlow wrote:Photos from Fireground360:

http://www.fireground360.com/web360/charlemont-ma-train-derailment


Looking at these photos there is apparently an access road along these tracks (most likely the former second track) that would make cleanup go much faster.
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby gokeefe » Sun May 15, 2016 10:49 am

Given that the train derailed on a curve you have to wonder how the crew caught it. Almost looks to me as if the ground actually acted as the braking force (as opposed to emergency braking).
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby newpylong » Sun May 15, 2016 11:57 am

How the crew caught it? Cars in the dirt that bad you feel it.
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby gokeefe » Sun May 15, 2016 12:00 pm

newpylong wrote:How the crew caught it?


How they became aware that the train had derailed and applied the emergency brakes. The train itself does not appear to have derailed in such a way that would have broken hose connections on the brake line. But .... that's an observation based on no direct operating knowledge and minimal photography of the scene.
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby johnpbarlow » Sun May 15, 2016 1:04 pm

Excerpt from Ensco (self-proclaimed leading provider of railway safety technologies throughout the world) article entitled: "Keeping Your Trains on the Track – Strategies for Preventing Derailments"

Gage Widening and Rail Rollover
The problems that can be encountered with excessive wheel/rail interaction forces are not limited to wheel climb scenarios. For instance, if the lateral force generated by the flange contact between the wheel and the rail is relatively high, this force can cause lateral rail displacement. This rail displacement produces what is known as gage widening and can lead to a wheel/rail separation as shown in Figure 2.

Rail rollover, as shown in the left side of Figure 3, is one of the most common sources of accidents especially when the vehicle travels over the spiral transition between tangent, or straight, track and the full body of a curve. The critical value of L/V for rail rollover is approximated by the ratio D/H with D and H defined as per the illustration on the right side Figure 3. If the moment generated by the lateral force is higher than the moment generated by the vertical force, the rail can rotate about its corner.

Full article is at http://www.ensco.com/News-Media/pressreleases.htm&artcat=2&article=128
Attachments
Gage Widening.JPG
Figure 2 Illustration of Gage Widening
Gage Widening.JPG (14.16 KiB) Viewed 1543 times
Rail Rollover.JPG
Figure 3: Illustration of Rail Rollover
Rail Rollover.JPG (13.72 KiB) Viewed 1543 times
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby newpylong » Sun May 15, 2016 2:23 pm

gokeefe wrote:
newpylong wrote:How the crew caught it?


How they became aware that the train had derailed and applied the emergency brakes. The train itself does not appear to have derailed in such a way that would have broken hose connections on the brake line. But .... that's an observation based on no direct operating knowledge and minimal photography of the scene.


Well as I said the engineer would feel it. Those trains are light you feel everything. Every train has a feel and it wouldn't be hard to tell something with wrong with just a truck off. A heavy 80 car freight harder to tell if it's near the rear.
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby NHV 669 » Sun May 15, 2016 5:10 pm

Given that the Recorder article shows the rear loco within a few cars of the first wheels on the ground, the crew probably caught it with their eyeballs as well. Just my $.02
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby Mikejf » Sun May 15, 2016 5:11 pm

The derailment is on the head end too. What I find rather interesting is the rail rolled under the cars and not the locomotives? Or could the rail rolling be a result of another defect, like broken joint bar or rail?
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby johnpbarlow » Mon May 16, 2016 4:19 am

PAS trains may be on the move through Charlemont as of today per this news report: http://www.westernmassnews.com/story/31974468/pan-am-railways-train-derails-on-route-8a-in-charlemont

Did PAR use their wreck crane from E Deerfield to re-rail everything?
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby newpylong » Mon May 16, 2016 6:02 am

They are using the over the road crane.

Still rerailing this AM.
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby johnpbarlow » Mon May 16, 2016 8:05 am

There's talk of some eb detours over CSX on the CSX B&A Yahoo forum: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/CSX-Boston-Line/conversations/messages/7764
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Re: West-of-Deerfield Gawking

Postby gokeefe » Mon May 16, 2016 9:59 am

Mikejf wrote:The derailment is on the head end too. What I find rather interesting is the rail rolled under the cars and not the locomotives? Or could the rail rolling be a result of another defect, like broken joint bar or rail?


Sounds like a tie and spike problem to me. Heavy engines travel over the rail on the curve, crush the remaining ties but hold the rail in place due to weight. Once the heavy weight passes the rail rolls over when the well car passes (with greater lateral force than vertical). (?)
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