Oil Trains

Discussion of present-day CM&Q operations, as well as discussion of predecessors Montreal, Maine & Atlantic Railway (MMA) and Bangor & Aroostook Railroad (BAR).

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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby KSmitty » Thu Aug 16, 2012 5:31 pm

gokeefe wrote:
CN9634 wrote:More oil runs and continues to run over the MMA than PAR. They run dediated oil trains about once or twice a week as well as oil comes in on general freight (unlike Pan Am)


Just to clarify, you're indicating that MMA is regularly running oil trains, perhaps more often than PAR?

Yes.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby gokeefe » Thu Aug 16, 2012 7:57 pm

KSmitty wrote:
gokeefe wrote:
CN9634 wrote:More oil runs and continues to run over the MMA than PAR. They run dediated oil trains about once or twice a week as well as oil comes in on general freight (unlike Pan Am)


Just to clarify, you're indicating that MMA is regularly running oil trains, perhaps more often than PAR?

Yes.


That's great news.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby CN9634 » Thu Aug 16, 2012 10:30 pm

There is at least 1 DEDICATE move per week, usually 80 or 100 cars of oil but also every train coming in has anywhere from 10 to 60 oil cars on it. Every train. MMA's problems right now are lack of motors and crews.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby JayBee » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:15 am

There is a 606-276 on the Lineup for tonight, August 18th, 2012 at Chicago Bensenville Yd. bound for the MM&A and St. John, NB
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby fogg1703 » Sat Nov 24, 2012 4:10 pm

Curious if loose car movements are still common on MMA as it seems there is an uptick on CN of blocks of crude to Irving.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby KSmitty » Sat Nov 24, 2012 5:28 pm

NBSR's westbound Monday had a LONG block of oil on the rear behind manifest and 20 or so empty auto racks. Don't know if this is common or not still, but its still happening on occasion.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby gpp111 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:15 am

The thirsty oil refineries on the east coast of North America are being pinched by their reliance on high priced foreign oil pegged at Brent pricing. This is significantly more expensive than shale oil coming from the Bakken formation. The largest grouping of such refineries are along the Delaware River in and south of Philadelphia. These refineries are trying to get more oil from the Bakken but generally lack rail facilities to unload product since these plants are set up to unload barges and tankers and not rail cars. There is a plan to construct one large oil car unloading facility, the product would be transferred to barges, that would then move up the coast (in some cases just a few miles) where they would be unloaded at the refinery.

http://articles.philly.com/2012-11-28/b ... stone-rail

Perhaps the barge routing from Albany to the Irving refinery in St. John would be like this. Not replacing but supplanting rail transport of Bakken crude. Of course, Irving likes to squeeze all its suppliers and by having as many suppliers as possible (MM&A, PanAm, CN) and now barge for this oil, this keeps shipment costs low. So the MM&A certainly can benefit from these oil trains but I remember the day when Irving used Iron Roads (Canadian American) against CN when routing for paper, and the revenue per unit was so low that it was hardly profitable. One thing for sure, these oil trains will be hard on the tracks and there will have to be an investment to keep them up to snuff.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby fogg1703 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:29 am

While the Irving's shrewd business practices cannot be understated, do they have control over the routing?
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby KSmitty » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:10 pm

fogg1703 wrote:While the Irving's shrewd business practices cannot be understated, do they have control over the routing?

Not over the specific routing, but over the general routing. Irving can seek quotes from CN, MMA, PAR, and choose the best price. Ultimately though, if PAR, for example, chose to run the trains through Worcester rather than Rotterdam that decision falls on the railroad not the customer. So long as contract price and delivery times are met...
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby fogg1703 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 3:38 pm

Well to a certain degree the routings are set because of where the train is sourced. A CP train is MMA bound, while a BNSF train is PAR and now CN bound. As predicted the Irving's are keeping this competition very tight as the contracts are a month or two at the most before they renegotiate.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby fromway » Wed Mar 27, 2013 6:57 pm

Has MMA picked up any of the oil trains since the PAN AM wreck? There were pictures of new equipment with oil cans.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby fromway » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:50 am

CP put some oil cans on the ground in Minnesota. One ruptured and two others leaked when moving them. EPA says that they are having trouble cleaining up due to cold weather. The oil is clumping up.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby fromway » Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:13 pm

My mistake. It was the CP that put the cars over, not the CN.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby gokeefe » Sun Mar 31, 2013 5:50 pm

fromway wrote:CP put some oil cans on the ground in Minnesota. One ruptured and two others leaked when moving them. EPA says that they are having trouble cleaining up due to cold weather. The oil is clumping up.


That is actually a good thing as it prevents absorption into the ground, spread of the spill and lowers any hazard of combustion. Obviously a big pain for the normal cleanup methods but it really does help restrict the environmental damage.
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Re: Crude Oil movement via MMA

Postby CN9634 » Sun Mar 31, 2013 7:08 pm

The MMA has been moving more oil than Pan Am from the start. They have also been running it longer (time wise). They run about 3 unit jobs a week and many others mixed in general freight.
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