Maine Northern Railway (ex-MMA lines operated by EMR/NBSR)

Discussion of present-day CM&Q operations, as well as discussion of predecessors Montreal, Maine & Atlantic Railway (MMA) and Bangor & Aroostook Railroad (BAR).

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Maine Northern Railway (ex-MMA lines operated by EMR/NBSR)

Postby fogg1703 » Sat May 14, 2011 2:32 pm

Things have been relatively quiet for being a month before the proposed takeover. Any word on schedules or where train starts will be based out of in Aroostook? How about any new motive power for EMRY? What will MMA do with its "excess" motive power? The takeover must free up at least 5 or 6 diesels from working the lines.
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Re: EMRY Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby ShortlinesUSA » Sat May 14, 2011 3:49 pm

Good to start a separate thread on this. We were discussing this in the "Woodland Spur" thread below, but I'll repost it here in hopes that this will become the central thread as the takeover date approaches.

Right now, nothing concrete seems to be known. At least two sources have suggested a startup date around July 1st, and that is pretty much it. One would think they would keep a crew start location at Squa Pan, ME to serve the Presque Isle branch cluster. There is a yard and office there, so I would think it's a safe bet that will remain as a base for locals up north. South crew base would probably be Brownville Junction, and possibly a northern base at Madawaska, but it just doesn't seem to me like much will move north of Lumber Alley just south of Portage, ME unless an interchange with CN via MMA is worked out. With the whole Twin Rivers shipping dispute ongoing, and them trucking product to CN across the border, the north end just doesn't seem to be a source of much traffic, unless EMRY can bring something in from the south. That would still require the dispute with MMA to be solved, as they would be the railroad actually delivering cars to the mill.

Inputs and addtions are welcome.
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Re: EMRY Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby RRBUFF » Sat May 14, 2011 3:51 pm

There is a Help Wanted advertisement in to days Bangor Daily News for many positions open for the EMRY takeover.
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Re: EMRY Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby fogg1703 » Sat May 14, 2011 5:10 pm

As for Twin Rivers, I was under the impression that most of the chemicals/kaolin came in on the MMA and the pulp and finished paper were CN traffic. Now with the added cost of another carrier (MMA) in the mix, I wonder if that equation will change to a transload from CN back across the river to the Madawaska side. If this is the case, this would constitute a large amount of the higher margin traffic north of Millinocket that both MMA and EMRY could lose.
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Re: EMRY Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby Cowford » Sun May 15, 2011 8:35 am

According to the agreement that was to be put in place, MMA was to be granted haulage rights (at a favorable rate) over the new road between Millinocket and Madawaska, so the additional road should factor into the equation. The rate was the same for all commodities.
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby jjoyce1 » Mon May 16, 2011 2:31 pm

Don't forget about the LMS lumber transload in Van Buren, for Irving and Fraser (Plaster Rock) loads among others.

JAJ
who is visiting MMA territory in a month
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby carchecker » Mon May 16, 2011 7:34 pm

NBSR has purchased at least four units from Union Pacific. Not sure what type they are but they're suppose to arrive soon. Hard to say if they will use them on their own tracks or if they will be assigned to the Aroostook Lines.
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby Highball » Tue May 17, 2011 12:44 am

I understand the three NBSR GP 38-2's, road numbers 2317 - 2319 ( along with road slug 008, mothered to 2318 ) are to operate the Northern Maine area trackage. These GP's have stenciling below their cab windows " Owned by Eastern Maine Railway ".

It will be interesting to see if the four UP units NBSR has purchased are four or six axle, now that the mainline in New Brunswick is 286 k compliant, with the track upgrades in the past two years. CP RAIL ran their large alcos ( M 636's, M 630's ) commonly on the mainlines in New Brunswick and through Maine, but some former CP M.O.W. personnel ( now working for NBSR ) have mentioned the six axles were very difficult maintenance wise, on the track structure.

During the recent NBSR upgrade, 25 miles of 115 lb rail was installed west from St. John N.B., the remainder is 100 lb to the Maine border at Vanceboro. The EMRY rail at Vanceboro is 112 lb and I assume the stretch of the former MEC to Mattawamkeag is the same weight.............then from the Keag to Brownville J'c't 100 lb.
Last edited by Highball on Tue May 17, 2011 7:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby MEC407 » Tue May 17, 2011 10:49 am

Tight curves are where six-axle units can do a beating on the tracks. Weight often isn't the issue; per-axle weight is often the same, or less than, a four-axle unit. Example: SD40-2 at 390,000 LBs is 65,000 LBs per axle; GP40-2 at 270,000 LBs is 67,500 LBs per axle.

Now I'm not saying you'd want to run an SD40-2 or M636 on ancient 85 LB rail, but on 112 LB rail I'm sure it would be fine as long as the curves aren't too tight. I remember seeing Conrail's big six-axle GEs on Guilford's mainline in Maine back when that was still 112 LB stick rail (and poorly maintained at that).

Someone on the GuilfordRailSightings group mentioned that the "new" units coming to NBSR are GP38-3s from UP. They didn't cite a source for that information, though.
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby ShortlinesUSA » Tue May 17, 2011 12:12 pm

If that is the case with the GP38-3s, they probably arent' coming directly from UP, because I don't know of them unloading any. However, they did have a group of GP38-3 rebuilds they turned back to Helm a few years ago that are in 900 and 1000 series numbers. Those are finding new homes after being leased to KCS for a while, then returned. Now we're really getting deep-- speculating on unconfirmed rumors. Internet discussion at its best!
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby carchecker » Wed May 18, 2011 5:29 am

Sounds like you could be right shortline. I am being told they may be units UP 906, 909, 913, and 917. Could be wrong on that also but it sounds like we won't have to wait very long.
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby GP40MC1118 » Sun May 22, 2011 9:00 pm

Those UP units are rebuilt GP38 & GP38AC's by MPI and sold to UP. UP retired them in 2007 and they went to
Helm Leasing. Helm leased three of the four to KCS, while the fourth unit spent some time on a Texas
shortline (W.Texas & Lubbock). All four went to MEI (Metro-East Industries in E.St.Louis). Presumably,
that's where they are coming out of.

They have a varied backround....Clinchfield, L&B, SCL & B&O...

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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby GP40MC1118 » Sun May 22, 2011 9:00 pm

Make that L&N, not L&B...

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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby CN9634 » Mon May 23, 2011 10:40 am

An interesting letter to the STB regarding the transaction...

http://www.stb.dot.gov/filings/all.nsf/ ... 229559.pdf

According to this, the NBSR/EMRY is not the company leasing the rail lines but rather the "Maine Northern Railway Company" (MNRC) will be. This must be another NBSR subsidiary or paper company? Or maybe a subsidiary of the EMRY? This is very confusing.

In regards to equipment purchases, the NBSR/EMRY/MNRC or whatever you want to call the new operator, will not just be purchasing locomotives but will also be bringing in additional rolling stock. If this MNRC is real then perhaps these reporting marks will show up.

EDIT: Further research found this...


EMR, like MNRC, is wholly owned by The New Brunswick Railway Company
("NBRC"), a non-carrier. Upon filing its Notice for a Modified Certificate under 49 CFR §
1150.23, MNRC would become a Class III rail carrier. EMR, too, is a Class III carrier.
Therefore, NBRC's control of two separate rail carriers would be subject to 49 USC §§ 11323
and 1132


Source: http://www.stb.dot.gov/filings/all.nsf/ ... 229561.PDF
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Re: Eastern Maine Railway/NBSR Aroostook Lines takeover

Postby ShortlinesUSA » Tue May 24, 2011 10:05 pm

I think the most interesting thing to note in the filing (the second link) is that MMA has filed notice they intend to cease service over the subject lines on JUNE 14th. A good deal of the second filing shows the NBSR is scrambling to get the trackage rights agreements with the MMA approved by the STB on an expedited basis so that uninterrupted rail service may continue.
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