Lake Shore Limited

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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby Gilbert B Norman » Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:57 am

bratkinson wrote:Certainly having fewer cars than prior year consists saves $$ due to fuel, wear & tear, and payroll. But at the same time, it makes getting a seat or a roomette almost impossible this summer. It also has the effect of driving prices up to get more revenue.

Mr. Atkinson, I think that is the "name of the Anderson game".

Just think, what if the LD's he simply can't whack, were to be converted to Single Level, using the apparently iminent car order, and all Superliners retired (off to spend their Golden Years at Corridor Capital's "Coston Farm" :P), with only one line per set, there would be enough Viewliners, on hand or on order, to cover all existing LD's. 70 V-Bags covers all trains with such, so should 75 V-Snoozes.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby ryanov » Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:45 pm

Backshophoss wrote:Any "spare cars" are on the Silver service to Fl,with the "Starvation"getting the "extra" Sleeper

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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby chrsjrcj » Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:47 pm

I haven’t seen any extra cars on the Star. Typical 3 or 4 coaches and 2 sleepers.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby Noel Weaver » Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:26 pm

chrsjrcj wrote:I haven’t seen any extra cars on the Star. Typical 3 or 4 coaches and 2 sleepers.


I have been re-reading some of my old Seaboard/ACL books, today is a far cry from the days of 18 cars with maybe 10 sleepers, 2 diners and lots of other stuff. Some of the passenger stations here still have long enough platforms to accomodate 18 cars too. Today's Amtrak trains are sure a let down from the 60's in the SCL days.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby bostontrainguy » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:41 pm

bratkinson wrote:The only reasonable conclusion I can come up with for the 'loss' of 3 revenue cars is that platform length in Boston won't handle more than 8-9 cars, especially if behind 2 locomotives when pulling in. The times I've entered Boston on an 8 car (usual size) regional train, the business class car is almost at the end of the platform, and that's with a single electric locomotive up front and no baggage car.


Doing a quick Google Earth measurement of South Station, it appears that the longest platform is roughly about 1240 feet. Divide it by 85 feet and you get 14 cars. That's pretty tight but maybe 12 with two engines?
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby David Benton » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:23 pm

Is it possible they are adding / subtracting a car at Albany?
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby bostontrainguy » Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:22 pm

TRAIN.jpg
bratkinson wrote:The only reasonable conclusion I can come up with for the 'loss' of 3 revenue cars is that platform length in Boston won't handle more than 8-9 cars, especially if behind 2 locomotives when pulling in. The times I've entered Boston on an 8 car (usual size) regional train, the business class car is almost at the end of the platform, and that's with a single electric locomotive up front and no baggage car.


Well here is a pic of a 1 engine/11 car train out of Boston, so more than 8-9 cars.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby ThirdRail7 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:07 pm

bratkinson wrote:The only reasonable conclusion I can come up with for the 'loss' of 3 revenue cars is that platform length in Boston won't handle more than 8-9 cars, especially if behind 2 locomotives when pulling in. The times I've entered Boston on an 8 car (usual size) regional train, the business class car is almost at the end of the platform, and that's with a single electric locomotive up front and no baggage car.

Any other ideas why the Lakeshore Ltd isn't running with the full complement of cars?


The problem is storing the train in Southampton yard. The full consist wouldn't fit for the period of dwell time without fouling and they didn't have the space to break it into many pieces. They also needed a little breathing room to move equipment since the Empire connection is o/o/s.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby Railjunkie » Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:58 am

David Benton wrote:Is it possible they are adding / subtracting a car at Albany?


Nope on the cars its a crew change gas and go.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby BandA » Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:54 pm

ThirdRail7 wrote:
bratkinson wrote:The only reasonable conclusion I can come up with for the 'loss' of 3 revenue cars is that platform length in Boston won't handle more than 8-9 cars, especially if behind 2 locomotives when pulling in. The times I've entered Boston on an 8 car (usual size) regional train, the business class car is almost at the end of the platform, and that's with a single electric locomotive up front and no baggage car.

Any other ideas why the Lakeshore Ltd isn't running with the full complement of cars?


The problem is storing the train in Southampton yard. The full consist wouldn't fit for the period of dwell time without fouling and they didn't have the space to break it into many pieces. They also needed a little breathing room to move equipment since the Empire connection is o/o/s.

Most of the middle tracks at BOS, apparently tracks 3-11, are pretty long http://www.massdot.state.ma.us/Portals/25/docs/DEIR/appendix/02-Appendix2.pdf sec. 3.2.3
Tracks 1, 2, and 12 can hold a maximum of seven-car trainsets each for MBTA trains and Track 13 can only hold a maximum of six-car trainsets.
The "T" runs push-pull, I believe the Lake Shore Ltd. is engine forward, so they probably don't pull all the way in. Then they would have to wye & service the train.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby ThirdRail7 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:01 am

BandA wrote:
ThirdRail7 wrote:
bratkinson wrote:The only reasonable conclusion I can come up with for the 'loss' of 3 revenue cars is that platform length in Boston won't handle more than 8-9 cars, especially if behind 2 locomotives when pulling in. The times I've entered Boston on an 8 car (usual size) regional train, the business class car is almost at the end of the platform, and that's with a single electric locomotive up front and no baggage car.

Any other ideas why the Lakeshore Ltd isn't running with the full complement of cars?


The problem is storing the train in Southampton yard. The full consist wouldn't fit for the period of dwell time without fouling and they didn't have the space to break it into many pieces. They also needed a little breathing room to move equipment since the Empire connection is o/o/s.

Most of the middle tracks at BOS, apparently tracks 3-11, are pretty long http://www.massdot.state.ma.us/Portals/25/docs/DEIR/appendix/02-Appendix2.pdf sec. 3.2.3
Tracks 1, 2, and 12 can hold a maximum of seven-car trainsets each for MBTA trains and Track 13 can only hold a maximum of six-car trainsets.
The "T" runs push-pull, I believe the Lake Shore Ltd. is engine forward, so they probably don't pull all the way in. Then they would have to wye & service the train.


I'm not sure why you're bringing up the track length in BOS when I stated Southampton yard has the issue with the fouling points. Moons ago, you could foul tracks and the yardmaster could protect the equipment. Due to a change in federal regulations, that is no longer the case. This has hampered operations in various yards and terminals.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby bostontrainguy » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:48 am

Widdett.jpg
ThirdRail7 wrote:I'm not sure why you're bringing up the track length in BOS when I stated Southampton yard has the issue with the fouling points. Moons ago, you could foul tracks and the yardmaster could protect the equipment. Due to a change in federal regulations, that is no longer the case. This has hampered operations in various yards and terminals.


The Powers That Be in Boston have this lame idea of turning Widett Circle into some kind of "neighborhood". Hopefully someone realizes that that idea is dumb (lousy place to live really) and Widett Circle has to be preserved for rail yard expansion before it's too late. It is uniquely positioned and such a rare opportunity that cannot be duplicated elsewhere.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby BandA » Sat Jul 21, 2018 9:19 pm

We're getting a bit into the weeds, but the problem is the city of Boston doesn't really care about railroad service (except demanding and getting special fares within the city). Anything beyond 5 miles they don't care about. Somebody Else is paying and they get to collect the property tax on all the downtown and seaport office space. The once-a-day Lake Shore Ltd. isn't even on their radar.
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby R&DB » Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:32 am

Is the Lake Shore Limited now running just Albany to Chicago and back due to the CSX derailment in Worcester?
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Re: Lake Shore Limited

Postby Trinnau » Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:57 pm

CSX derailment was not on track the LSL operates on. The LSL was already bus-substituted this weekend (and the next two weekends) for work in MBTA territory.
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