PURCHASE ORDER For New Locomotives

[frequentflyer]

https://media.amtrak.com/2018/06/amtrak ... ive-fleet/

Only 50-75 locomotives to replace 200 or so Genesis. The states order Chargers has helped Amtrak alot in lessening the need to order as many locomotives. And that the DMU/EMU idea may be more real than we think.

[electricron]

The proposed RFP also included rebuilding the existing locomotives and converting them to AC drive.
It’ll be interesting to see who wins the bidding process. GE has been rebuilding freight DASH locomtivex in Fort Worth, converting DC into AC drive. So an all brand new fleet of long distance diesel locomotives isn’t a done deal yet. But the process to do so is moving along.

[mark777]

I can see them going for the Chargers on this considering that they are using them on state sponsored trains across the country. Although the cheaper route might be a rebuild. I'm not sure how successful and efficient the rebuilt GEs are but if a rebuild is only gonna buy some time before a replacement is needed, then I would think that a new locomotive would be a better choice. There is a request for higher horsepower on the RFP, But I would think that the present HP ratings on the Chargers are the highest one will go. a rebuilt P42 could be brought up to 4,400 HP to meet that criteria, so it would be very interesting to see where this goes. I don't see the EMD F125 being a contender and I don't see Bombardier, Alstom or Brookville doing the same either. It would also make more sense to go for the Chargers for commonality purposes.

[Backshophoss]

Am still leery of the Cummings prime mover for the LD services,for now the chargers have only done short distance work in the corridors,
and seem to be holding up with little or no problems.
A remanufacturing of the P42's with EVO prime movers and AC traction and better HEP inverters would seem to be a better bet,
as those items have proven to do well in freight service.
Remember the HSP-46 was a customized project for the MBTA,and "over customized" by them to boot

[mark777]

Actually you do have a point with MBTA's HSP46 and as long as we are on the subject, The customization of Locomotive orders also yielded LIRR's DE/DM30AC's which had too much of what we call "growing pains." I still see it as a GE rebuild vs the Charger order. This is my personal opinion, but I actually find the P40/ P42s to be nicer looking than the new Chargers, so a rebuilt Gennie will still look nice on the rails and not look outdated. Add in those LED lights and we get the modern feel to it. I agree, the Chargers still need more time on the rails to see how they do on the long haul. If GE can even better the fuel economics on these rebuilds, Amtrak may find them a better fit for their needs. Let us not forget the P32DMs on Amtrak and MNR. While newer, a rebuild could be useful in the nearer future for them, and with currently no other DM locomotive on the market, it is more than likely that those units would be kept longer unless Siemens comes out with a DM Charger which has been rumored to be a consideration especially for the NYC area RRs. IF they do, Siemens might have the upper hand on this.

[DutchRailnut]

RFP means nothing, it only asks for price of either a new locomotive or rebuilding, its like shopping for a best deal.
note that the actual RFP has very little specifications on what they actually want , or how far a rebuild should be taken.

[DutchRailnut]

Here is actual RFP, it lacks details , no technical requirements etc . sad part about GE is they leave customer hanging by not maintaining a parts supply .
Both Amtrak and MN have trouble getting parts to keep current fleet operational.

https://procurement.amtrak.com/irj/port ... 6565a217df

[Nasadowsk]

sad part about GE is they leave customer hanging by not maintaining a parts supply .

GE seems to do this, accross the board.

I'm still at a loss as to why they're in some of the markets they're in...

[D40LF]

A remanufacturing of the P42's with EVO prime movers and AC traction and better HEP inverters would seem to be a better bet,
as those items have proven to do well in freight service.

I'm not sure how I feel about a P40/42 rebuild. The engine room is pretty tight, so a new GEVO engine might not fit inside. I'd say if Amtrak does opt for a Genesis rebuild, they would probably just overhaul and upgrade the existing 7FDL engines, like GE has done with modernized freight units.

Another major concern I have about a Genesis rebuild is the lifespan of structural components, and/or how they could be modified. The fabricated trucks are aging, and I'n not sure how much longer they can last as some have developed cracks (or whether new AC motors could be installed). Monocoque carbodies could be difficult to reconfigure, and they might also suffer from corrosion damage.

Overall, I think that new power might be the best way to go...

[DutchRailnut]

but then, people with much higher pay grades make those decisions

[dowlingm]

A decision to go the rebuild route would probably be great for VIA Rail because there might be a market to sell their 21 P42s (built in 2001) into rebuilding/parts teardown when (please the railroad gods) the money comes from Ottawa to buy Siemens trainsets for Toronto-Ottawa-Montreal corridor services.

Of course, transborder cooperation isn't so hot these days...

[frequentflyer]

CEO Anderson is going to want some competition in this bid. When he was at Delta, he was known for being a hard nose negotiator for new aircraft. And bought used aircraft to keep CAPEX down.

With that said, many thinks this Siemens bid to loose. Someone has options for 150 Chargers with larger fuel tanks. But how much of a chance does the EMD F125 have? Any word yet from California how they are operating? Bugs ironed out? Then again Siemens will have the infrastructure in place to perform mx on the Chargers for the states that have ordered them.

I do not take the "rebuild" part of this bid that seriously.

[SRich]

Personally i think that it wil be the Siemens Charger. They can retire then al the p40/p42 and have only one locomotive for the staties and LD (excempt de DP P32).

[mtuandrew]

Personally i think that it wil be the Siemens Charger. They can retire then al the p40/p42 and have only one locomotive for the staties and LD (excempt de DP P32).

There’s a very good chance the P32ACDM will be replaced by a Charger derivative too, so Amtrak would move to a fully-Siemens roster of road engines.

[John_Perkowski]

Will WABCO's merged GE business even be interested in building a B-B unit?

Is the any GE new production not C-C?