Amtrak reducing/eliminating discounts effective Jan 9?

[David Benton]

That's a good tip , PRR60.
It would be nice to be able to take the kids, with cousins or friends, to the zoo without feeling I may have to extend the mortgage !.

[AgentSkelly]

Again, I’m an AAA Oregon/Idaho Employee.

I have confirmed it is indeed true. There will be no AAA discount past February 2018.

[Suburban Station]

https://www.transit.dot.gov/regulations-and-guidance/civil-rights-ada/frequently-asked-questions#41

Under 49 U.S.C. Section 5307(d)(1)(D) of the Federal Transit Act, federally subsidized transit providers may not charge more than half of the peak fare for fixed route transit during off-peak hours for seniors, people with disabilities, and Medicare cardholders.

I thought Amtrak & CR are regulated by the FRA rather than the FTA. Previous poster stated that the Downeaster receives FTA subsidies, so they are on-the-hook. What is "off-peak hours" for Amtrak? Doesn't make sense for LD trains, sold out trains or really any assigned-seating trains or demand-priced trains.

Providing discounts for welfare, old people, young people, students, veterans, military, and associations/clubs are all nice-to-have, but we need to stop thinking of transit as a welfare benefit, but rather valuable infrastructure that folks are glad to pay market price for.

the Keystone is in the same boat as the Downeaster. I actually don't think providing discounted rides for children has anything to do with thinking of transportation as a welfare benefit. the PRR had generous companion fare and child discounts in its day. it's a wise move to fill seats and get around the group fare problem. that is, while selling the fare to one person may be competitive at a higher price, you become less and less competitive as you add people to the group. trains are not planes so filling extra capacity makes sense. seniors likewise have time but a fixed income. remember, this isn't like someone going from NY to LA where flying is the only realistic option, LA-SD competes with cars and buses. It's scenic and pleasant but not fast. I think cutting back on fare discounts is wise generally but the restricting the not very generous child discounts seems foolish.

[gokeefe]

One of the big issues here is that the basic tariff is what covers the NEC. They are capacity constrained and can get more revenue from those trains if they make these changes. Unfortunately for everyone else this becomes a problem on trains and/or services that are not perennially SRO.

[JPoland]

Amtrak is telling people to have less kids and use birth control? One Kid One Parent One discount? I assume the way around this is as your in the ticket line let the person behind you in the ticket line borrow your kid and get the discount.

[JPoland]

S what about the Veterans Advantage Card-https://www.veteransadvantage.com/

[Arlington]

Discounts should only be offered as a way of enticing marginal trips onto Amtrak. Discounting is only a "win" when enough "new people" ride to make up for the fact that a certain number of $ get lost as "regular people" grab a discount who would have ridden anyway(without a discount).

Discounts get offered because each targeted group has a good reason for NOT travelling Amtrak, and Amtrak wanted to nudge them onto trains, without offering a blanket discount to people who don't need it (eg. high income and business travelers)/

Historically, the AAA discount was good for the railroad because it invited skeptics aboard.

That's how I interpreted it: Every AAA member has access to a car--and so much devotion to car travel that they think AAA is worth joining.

Having a car and being willing to use it, AAA members are/were freer to NOT choose Amtrak than the average person. A targeted discount had the potential to nudge trips that were highly-likely to have been made by car to rail instead. But maybe too many habitual users were using the AAA discount, versus not enough "first-timers" being enticed in. Amtrak likely has good data showing that AAA had dried up as a source of converts and was mostly giving back too many dollars to the converted.

Senior, student, & military discounts all theoretically target people with limited discretionary income. Children generally have no income at all. These discounts were a way of selectively enticing price-sensitive discretionary trips onto Amtrak that high "normal" prices might have scared away. I'd also note that while leisure venues (museums, theaters, theme parks) offer kids discounts, they seem to be fading with at least airlines (offered only to "lap babies" and not for "real seats")

As Tadman says, given fixed supply and growing demand, the *only* logical response is to raise prices. If you read the MPRs (are they back online?) it is pretty clear that the main way that Amtrak has been improving its performance in a period of stagnant (full) ridership, is plain old fare hikes.

Maybe they simply figured that their undiscounted prices are about where they need to be, but that the discounted prices were not enticing enough marginal riders. The message to the lowest-fare customers is: if you like Amtrak pay more (the normal prices everyone else is paying), if you prioritize being cheap, well, Amtrak would rather sell to someone who, ahem, likes Amtrak.

Most of the comments here have the flavor of: "I can see why you'd want to take other people's discounts, but not mine!" The reality is that if you'd have traveled without the discount, it was bad strategy on Amtrak's part to offer it to you.

Personally, I've used both the AAA and the 2-kids-with-me discounts, and the reality is that without them, I'd still have made the train trip. And 50% is a pretty big discount--almost any other passenger would pay for that 2nd kid's seat. Amtrak was leaving money on the table at a time when overall they're (still) losing money. Amtrak is fixing that.

The net effect is that ridership will look more mid-career businessey and a little less backpack-and-flipflop.

[gokeefe]

S what about the Veterans Advantage Card-https://www.veteransadvantage.com/

Toast as far as we know. What has not changed however (to my knowledge) is the ability to take the disabled fare if you have a VA Healthcare card that shows "service connected".

[David Benton]

I think the reasoning behind the kids fare is similer to the AAA reason. If the kids are full price, its cheaper to drive. This way, you get to sell the equivalent of 2 fares, for an adult and 2 kids , even if it takes 3 seats.
Amtrak is not at capacity all the time, perhaps they should only offer these discounts when the train is not full.

[Suburban Station]

I think the reasoning behind the kids fare is similer to the AAA reason. If the kids are full price, its cheaper to drive. This way, you get to sell the equivalent of 2 fares, for an adult and 2 kids , even if it takes 3 seats.
Amtrak is not at capacity all the time, perhaps they should only offer these discounts when the train is not full.

Bingo.

[sicariis]

Emailed RPA and asked about the future of their Amtrak discount and received the following response:

Thank you for your inquiry. As of now there are no plans to scrap the RPA discount program. I hope this helps. Have a great day!

[StLouSteve]

Goodbye to AAA and Student discount and hello reduced eligibility for senior fares!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dr- ... a82e97b62d

[electricron]

I think the reasoning behind the kids fare is similer to the AAA reason. If the kids are full price, its cheaper to drive. This way, you get to sell the equivalent of 2 fares, for an adult and 2 kids , even if it takes 3 seats.
Amtrak is not at capacity all the time, perhaps they should only offer these discounts when the train is not full.

Bingo.

Then cheap passengers will always wait until the very last minute to buy tickets in hope for these discounts because their delays will result in less full train at their time of purchase.

There are always cheap schemers willing to try anything to save a penny - including risking all trains being sold out on their desired day to travel.

Regular discounts should be limited to those passengers mandated by law, sales with steep discounts should be aimed at specific passengers and for a very limited time. McDonald's doesn't run their Monopoly game promotion all year long.

[Arlington]

You can either headline this as
"Discounts end; Groups lament loss of cheap options"
or as
"Value & perceptions of train travel rise; Average customer likely willing to pay more"

I recommend the latter.

[R&DB]

I personally think they should offer the AAA discount on the Autotrain. Those passengers are already paying a premium to take the car along. And for every car they haul Amtrak is getting the money that the gas stations on I-95 aren't. The Autotrain is nearly always sold out. If they want to maximize the profit on this route, expand the service somehow. But that is the topic of 2 other threads. A large majority of the patrons of this route are over 65. Many are "snowbirds", south in late fall and north in the spring. They were not buying AAA just to get the cheapest fare, they just happen to have AAA. The discount would not even pay for their AAA. They are gonna take that train twice a year anyway.
I'm 66, don't fly and hate to drive more than 2-4 hours. Anytime we travel to Florida for a week or more, we take the car and Autotrain. (Saves car rental and no TSA or flight.