Cardinal discussion

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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby dowlingm » Sun Jun 10, 2018 7:19 am

David Benton wrote:The Cardinals eastbound service would start eating into nite worktime, if running late , which it is prone to do .
Also , I think someone mentioned a single level car shortage after the Star crash , this setup allows the Cardinal to use superliner cars if necessary.
I thought it was mentioned on here before that there was a restriction somewhere on the Cardinal route (not on the NEC) which required single level?
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby dgvrengineer » Sun Jun 10, 2018 7:43 pm

It used Superliner cars before when it was a Washington to Chicago train. Unless one of its many re-routes has put height restrictions on it, it shouldn't be a problem to use Superliner equipment.
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby jhdeasy » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:28 pm

Train 51(15) had only one sleeper in the consist. Train 50(21) has only one sleeper in the consist.

I thought the Cardinal was assigned two sleepers during the summer season?
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby RRspatch » Fri Jun 22, 2018 12:25 am

Two Viewliner sleepers got banged up pretty bad in the derailment of No.91 back in March. One had damage the the vestibule end with a corner post bent back. Not sure how much damage the other sleeper got. With that and 97/98 still running with three sleepers Amtrak might not have the cars to spare at this time. I'm surprised Amtrak didn't convert the train to Superliners with the train turning in DC. I believe the train only uses two sets of equipment. Train could be run with a baggage coach, coach, 37000 series diner/lounge and one sleeper. That would be 8 cars for two sets.
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby andrewjw » Fri Jun 22, 2018 9:25 am

Can Superliners run into WAS from the south? Are there any other low tunnels on the route?
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby mtuandrew » Fri Jun 22, 2018 6:25 pm

Unless CSX added a surprise height restriction somewhere in Coal Country, yes, the Cardinal is unrestricted into Washington Union Station. The station itself clears gallery cars from both the north and south approaches.
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby RRspatch » Sat Jun 23, 2018 1:12 am

Yes. Superliners have run on the Cardinal in the past. The ballast was undercut and the track lowered in both tunnels running under Capital hill. Virginia Rail Express runs bi-level cars through this tunnel as well. The other train that runs through this tunnel is Amtrak trains 952 and 953. These two trains are equipment moves between Washington and Lorton for Superliner equipment that needs to go to Chicago (29/30) and on to Beech Grove (850/851) for some reason. These trains run as needed.
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby dowlingm » Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:41 pm

How tight is Amtrak for Superliners at present - are some covering in the Seattle area after the Talgo wreck?
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby jp1822 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:58 pm

Amtrak has 50 Viewliners. It only requires 38 Viewliners in regular operation. Even with the two that were "damaged" in the Silver Star wreck - frankly I only thought there was one that had major damage, but OK - Amtrak has enough spares that it COULD if it wanted to run two extra Viewliners in the summer season. It has upped the required 38 to 40 for the summer before. If two Viewliners were pressed into to service with even two out of service, you'd have EIGHT Viewliners around as spares or rotation for maintenance etc.

50 TOTAL - 2 Silver Star Wreck - 38 Regular - 2 additional for Cardinal = 8 Spares

It's still adequate. Amtrak only keeps spare Viewliners in NY and Florida.

I can't figure out why Amtrak didn't run Superliners while the Cardinal is terminating in Washington DC, but again - whatever! Superliner Sightseer car on this route with a Cross Country Cafe would be the BEST! Superliner sleepers are available, and they only would likely need two coaches.

Each consist as a Superliner set (minimum):

Engine
Baggage
Superliner Sleeper (Crew and Revenue)
Cross Country Cafe
Sightseer Lounge (Yes, enough of these too)
Superliner Coach
Superliner Coach

x 2

=

2 Baggage
2 Superliner Sleeper (Crew and Revenue)
2 Cross Country Cafe (Plenty of these cars)
2 Sightseer Lounge (Yes, enough of these too)
4 Superliner Coach

A Trans-Dorm sleeper would only enhance the consist, and make it a stronger train. Sleeper space is ALWAYS booked up!!! Crew space is not that much on this train.

I agree with Mr. Norman that Amtrak should just try to operate a Viewliner Diner on this train in exchange for the Amfleet II Lounge (Diner Lite) car.

Originally David Gunn suggested that this route operate with a combined Diner/Cafe styled car that was Viewliner based......
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby ThirdRail7 » Sat Jul 21, 2018 12:12 am

Playing fleet manager again, JP1822? Well, in this case you are at least partially correct. The reason they didn't go to Superliner equipment is they are tight on equipment since some of it was sent west.

As for the Viewliners, there is a protect in WAS. It has actually been used a few times. However, you are correct in saying they could eek out another viewliner if they desired. This is because you left out one thing: The Lake Shore Limited is running with one less viewliner since the New York section was cut.

I suppose they cut it to one sleeper for the same reason they cut one off the LSL. Some people probably don't want to transfer and it maybe it was noticed in the reservations.

Still, it would have been nice to make the space available and see it you can fill them.
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby jp1822 » Sat Jul 21, 2018 5:49 pm

ThirdRail7 wrote:Still, it would have been nice to make the space available and see it you can fill them.


If Amtrak desired....... Key word - "desired."

Amtrak's "choosing" of its Viewliner Sleeper utilization is ridiculous, and I will always be a critic of the "dumbing down" in operations that Amtrak has done in regards to it (post-2005).
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby twropr » Sat Jul 21, 2018 7:04 pm

Has the CARDINAL run any extra coaches during this summer?
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby ryanov » Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:30 pm

ThirdRail7 wrote:Playing fleet manager again, JP1822? Well, in this case you are at least partially correct. The reason they didn't go to Superliner equipment is they are tight on equipment since some of it was sent west.

As for the Viewliners, there is a protect in WAS. It has actually been used a few times. However, you are correct in saying they could eek out another viewliner if they desired. This is because you left out one thing: The Lake Shore Limited is running with one less viewliner since the New York section was cut.

I suppose they cut it to one sleeper for the same reason they cut one off the LSL. Some people probably don't want to transfer and it maybe it was noticed in the reservations.

Still, it would have been nice to make the space available and see it you can fill them.


I can say this, apropos of both the Cardinal and the Lake Shore Limited: I'm booked on 449(25) and 50(31), for the entire length plus a transfer on both ends on both. On 449, only the Accessible Bedroom is available, for $1100. On 50, there are no sleeping accommodations available period. I know they're full initially because I called Amtrak to see if I could switch sides of the train on both reservations and it wasn't possible on either one. But I did check Amtrak.com as well before posting.

It would seem that Amtrak is leaving money on the table for at least those two days, but who knows.
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Re: Cardinal discussion

Postby jhdeasy » Fri Oct 12, 2018 12:34 pm

Planned summer season trackwork at New York is completed (so I am told), but The Cardinal is still operating as a Washington - Chicago train.

Amtrak trying to save money and/or free up track space at Sunnyside Yard?
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