Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Discussion Related to the Reading Company 1833-1976 and it's predecessors Philadelphia and Reading Rail Road and then the Philadelphia and Reading Railway.

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Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby RDGTRANSMUSEUM » Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:00 am

We are looking for the latest status and location of 2100. This is for an up coming book.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby Richard Glueck » Sat Nov 14, 2009 5:41 pm

She's in storage out in the west, but outdoors. The moist climate can't be good for her. Speculation is that she'll be sold at a loss, and likely for the value of her steel. Should a scrap dealer pony up the cash first, it could be disastrous for a functional and steam worthy locomotive. Serious negotiations should be entered to bring her back to Pennsylvania and return her to coal firing. The RT&HS should own her.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby RDGTRANSMUSEUM » Tue May 04, 2010 7:21 am

any more updates on her?
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby jrevans » Tue May 04, 2010 11:02 am

RDGTRANSMUSEUM wrote:any more updates on her?


As a summary, the conversion from coal burning to oil burning was not done is a manner conducive to the design of the 2100's boiler/firebox, causing her to steam poorly and possibly sustain firebox damage. Read these threads over on Trainorders and you'll see discussion from some of the people who actually fired the 2100 in Washington State. Poor, poor locomotive.... Actually talk of her possibly being sold for scrap value.

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/r ... 10,2120504
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/r ... 10,2110896

Since I'm no longer a member and they axed access for my "heritage account", I can only see the first page of these threads.

Some of the most interesting posts are those by Mr. Ross Rowland:

From all credible reports of those who were directly involved in the 2100's operation during this ill fated venture the rube goldberg set-up was an unqualified disaster.

It was impossible to maintain working pressure with anything beyond the throttle barely open and the evaporation rate was so poor that it couldn't even maintain pressure when the gun was turned on!!

In addition it has resulted in substantial damage to the firebox side sheets/combustion chamber due to improper air introduction mechanics/design.

In short, a total failure.

Fortunatly Mr. Payne went broke before anyone was seriously injured or worse, so I guess we need to be grateful for that!!

Darn shame as if he'd only accepted the help that was offerred to him by steam professionals that knew how to convert from coal to oil properly, all this potentially fatal to the machine damage could have been avoided!!


As the old saying goes...you can lead 'em to water............

Ross Rowland


You can make all the excuses,rationalizations etc. that you want but that doesn't alter the bottom line facts in this issue.

For the industrys sake let's hope that this ill fated venture is used as a teaching tool of what NOT to do if one wishes to convert a locomotive from a coal burner to oil. How badly this poorly engineeered system damaged the boiler is an open question and may never be fully addressed. From the available evidence there does appear to be substantial discoloration of areas of the sidesheets in the firebox and combustion chamber which may or may not be indicitive of serious internal damage??? The only way to really know is to do a VERY thorough boiler inspection ( including an ultrasound) by acredited professionals.

With the current state of the mainline steam game being what it is, the chances of anyone being willing to invest that kind of effort/money in the 2100 is EXTREMELY remote. I'm saddened to say that the overwhelming odds are that it will continue to sit in some remote corner of the world and eventually be forgotten. Sure hope I'm wrong but that's the reality.

The one slim chance for revival might be if she does get auctioned off to help pay some of the debt accumulated by Tom Payne and the buyer at that auction is a T-1 lover with a fat checkbook!!

Other than that I'm afraid her continuing value to the steam world will be as a stark real life example of how NOT to do things!!

Sad but true!!

Ross Rowland
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby daylight4449 » Sun Feb 20, 2011 12:09 pm

jrevans wrote:
RDGTRANSMUSEUM wrote:any more updates on her?


As a summary, the conversion from coal burning to oil burning was not done is a manner conducive to the design of the 2100's boiler/firebox, causing her to steam poorly and possibly sustain firebox damage. Read these threads over on Trainorders and you'll see discussion from some of the people who actually fired the 2100 in Washington State. Poor, poor locomotive.... Actually talk of her possibly being sold for scrap value.

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/r ... 10,2120504
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/r ... 10,2110896

Since I'm no longer a member and they axed access for my "heritage account", I can only see the first page of these threads.

Some of the most interesting posts are those by Mr. Ross Rowland:

From all credible reports of those who were directly involved in the 2100's operation during this ill fated venture the rube goldberg set-up was an unqualified disaster.

It was impossible to maintain working pressure with anything beyond the throttle barely open and the evaporation rate was so poor that it couldn't even maintain pressure when the gun was turned on!!

In addition it has resulted in substantial damage to the firebox side sheets/combustion chamber due to improper air introduction mechanics/design.

In short, a total failure.

Fortunatly Mr. Payne went broke before anyone was seriously injured or worse, so I guess we need to be grateful for that!!

Darn shame as if he'd only accepted the help that was offerred to him by steam professionals that knew how to convert from coal to oil properly, all this potentially fatal to the machine damage could have been avoided!!


As the old saying goes...you can lead 'em to water............

Ross Rowland


You can make all the excuses,rationalizations etc. that you want but that doesn't alter the bottom line facts in this issue.

For the industrys sake let's hope that this ill fated venture is used as a teaching tool of what NOT to do if one wishes to convert a locomotive from a coal burner to oil. How badly this poorly engineeered system damaged the boiler is an open question and may never be fully addressed. From the available evidence there does appear to be substantial discoloration of areas of the sidesheets in the firebox and combustion chamber which may or may not be indicitive of serious internal damage??? The only way to really know is to do a VERY thorough boiler inspection ( including an ultrasound) by acredited professionals.

With the current state of the mainline steam game being what it is, the chances of anyone being willing to invest that kind of effort/money in the 2100 is EXTREMELY remote. I'm saddened to say that the overwhelming odds are that it will continue to sit in some remote corner of the world and eventually be forgotten. Sure hope I'm wrong but that's the reality.

The one slim chance for revival might be if she does get auctioned off to help pay some of the debt accumulated by Tom Payne and the buyer at that auction is a T-1 lover with a fat checkbook!!

Other than that I'm afraid her continuing value to the steam world will be as a stark real life example of how NOT to do things!!

Sad but true!!

Ross Rowland


Well, Mr. Rowland may be wrong yet. I'm trying to help track down an avalible northern type for Jake Marcus at the Mt. Rainer Scenic. Sadly, I have no idea how to contact Tom Payne, who owns 2100. Maybe Mr. Rowland would know how to get in contact with him, but the website for the 614 went down about a week ago, so I have no idea how to contact him
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby RDGTRANSMUSEUM » Sun Feb 20, 2011 12:28 pm

I have talked with Mr Payne, he wants 1.5 million for 2100.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby daylight4449 » Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:38 pm

RDGTRANSMUSEUM wrote:I have talked with Mr Payne, he wants 1.5 million for 2100.

Jeez, he lost that much with it? Well, i shouldn't be suprised. Its not like it's cheap to get your hands on a northern.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby jrevans » Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:37 pm

daylight4449 wrote:
RDGTRANSMUSEUM wrote:I have talked with Mr Payne, he wants 1.5 million for 2100.

Jeez, he lost that much with it? Well, i shouldn't be suprised. Its not like it's cheap to get your hands on a northern.


According to another forum, there is supposedly a seven figure lien again the locomotive....
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby daylight4449 » Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:45 pm

jrevans wrote:
daylight4449 wrote:
RDGTRANSMUSEUM wrote:I have talked with Mr Payne, he wants 1.5 million for 2100.

Jeez, he lost that much with it? Well, i shouldn't be suprised. Its not like it's cheap to get your hands on a northern.


According to another forum, there is supposedly a seven figure lien again the locomotive....

Hu? Well, what's that supposed to mean?
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby jrevans » Sun Feb 20, 2011 11:36 pm

daylight4449 wrote:
jrevans wrote:According to another forum, there is supposedly a seven figure lien again the locomotive....

Hu? Well, what's that supposed to mean?


Here's the quote from the other forum:
It's my memory of this whole sad saga that the locomotive now carries a 7 figure lien against it by the wealthy ex-friend of Mr. Paynes who lent him in monies for the ill fated excursion operation with the engine as security for the loan.

The curious thing is why it has taken so long for the lien holder to auction off the asset in order to get at least some of his money back??

Guess someday all the facts will emerge??


That thread also referenced this link:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/l ... ay05m.html

Showing that Mr. Payne (owner of the 2100) is having some financial difficulties....
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby lvrr325 » Mon Feb 21, 2011 7:17 pm

Same thing as a lien on your automobile, it means someone (Mr. Payne I presume) took out a loan against the locomotive and the bank really owns it since Mr. Payne is apparently unable to make payments on it. Were it a car, the bank would reposess it and sell it. I think the problem here is not so much because it's a locomotive, but because of it's condition auctioning it off is not likely to bring enough money to be worthwhile.

Which, in relative terms the scrap value on that engine isn't going to be much, less than a tenth of what's owed on it - I'm not sure what the engine weighs or what grade of steel it would be considered, but it's better grade than what scrap automobiles are considered and those are in the $200/ton range as of this writing, so if you assume double that on 100 tons you get $40,000. Of course cut up (IE "processed") it's worth more than that - that's how scrap buyers make their money - but still doesn't bring it up to the debt amount.

The bank may look at it as a case of where waiting it out may be better for them - even if he can sell it for half his asking price that would be better than auctioning it and only getting scrap price, then subtracting auction costs, repo costs, legal fees, etc. and then still trying to collect the balance from the debtor down the road.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby RDGTRANSMUSEUM » Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:21 am

The condition of 2100 is excellent ready to go,fully certified,according to Mr.Payne. He invited anyone seriously interested to fly out and inspect anytime. Mr. Payne is quite knowlegable on the T's and the stoker will be included in the deal. It(stoker) is currently on display? in Canada.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby daylight4449 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:41 am

Then i can only hope that Mr. Payne/the bank would be willing to deal.
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Recent pictures of the 2100

Postby jrevans » Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:27 am

Here are some recent pictures of 2100 in 2012. (Lots of 2's, 1's and 0's there, eh?)

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=765929

According to what I've read over at RYPN, the status is still the same though. Mr. Payne still owns it and wants to run it again, and there seems to be real mechanical boiler issues.
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Re: Reading 2100 steam locomotive status

Postby lvrr325 » Sun Feb 26, 2012 8:09 pm

FWIW, the price of scrap keeps climbing with no stopping in sight, what was $200 when I made that last post is now $350 or better.
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