G&W to acquire P&W

Topics relating to the operation of the P&W Railroad, which is a subsidiary of Genesee and Wyoming. Regional freight railroad based in Worcester and operating in Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut and New York.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby Engineer Spike » Mon Oct 10, 2016 3:48 pm

I have been a P&W stockholder for quite a while. I just got a proxy on whether or not I support the sale. With Mr. Eder holding the majority of stock, isn't this academic? Is the charter still set up that each stockholder get the same number of votes, whether holding 1 share, or 1 million shares?
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby Noel Weaver » Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:22 pm

This seems unusual to me. I was a Delaware Otsego stockholder for a long period of time and Walter Rich always had a majority control but we always voted our shares. I have never heard of a stock corporation that allowed only one vote no matter how many shares were owned. Delaware Otsego was very good to me so I did not ever have any problems with the way it was managed.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby lakest101 » Tue Oct 11, 2016 9:57 pm

https://www.stb.gov/home.nsf/case?openf ... FD_36064_0

Docket got interesting with multiple parties objecting to the merger.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby johnpbarlow » Wed Oct 12, 2016 4:21 am

American Rock Salt is articulating reservations regarding GWI's acquisition of P&W based upon its disagreements over allegedly exorbitant rates GWI has set for ARS traffic and demurrage but the last sentence in the ARS letter may reveal their motivation to complain: "...One begins to think that the GWI's long term plan is to put ARS and its three hundred plus employees out of business so they can again own the mine that is now ARS as they once did."

https://www.stb.gov/filings/all.nsf/ba7f93537688b8e5852573210004b318/f81573f0b665aa6285258049006eb84a/$FILE/241730.pdf

The only other reservation stated to the STB re: the P&W acquisition is apparently Boston Surface RR is having difficulty getting GWI to discuss their proposed Worcester-Woonsocket-Providence commuter service:

Furthermore, BSRC believes its concern in this respect is valid, as GWI has neither
acknowledged any of P&W’s current passenger services, nor P&W’s extensive negotiations with
BSRC in its pending application. Since GWI’s application, BSRC and P&W’s negotiations have
been suspended without any definitive date upon which they will resume. What is more
concerning is that negotiations have ceased despite the fact that GWI has not yet acquired P&W
and is not legally able to exert control over it until the acquisition is complete. It is not
appropriate for GWI to suspend - or to direct P&W to suspend – P&W’s negotiations with BSRC.


https://www.stb.gov/filings/all.nsf/ba7f93537688b8e5852573210004b318/a88ca77f4f78893c85258049006d087f/$FILE/241727.pdf
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby lakest101 » Wed Oct 12, 2016 7:39 am

Actually two unions are objecting outright not just asking for conditions of approval. Basically over failure to communicate up front as well. And looks like ST/PanAM
cut a deal at the last minute, probably GWI realizing that there was quite a bit of concern. Union issues seem biggest followed by the failure to address BSRC and passenger excursions in their original petition. Makes them look shady to the board.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby johnpbarlow » Wed Oct 12, 2016 7:47 am

Good point about the two unions expressing concern. Unions have been wary of changes of ownership in other transactions as well (eg, NS acquisition of D&H South).
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby lakest101 » Wed Oct 12, 2016 8:28 am

I just read the American Rocksalt letter is GWI really that bad?
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby Dick H » Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:42 pm

While I am not betting the farm, the days of any passenger trains on any PW/G&W
trackage will be over on the date the sale becomes final. G&W will never shell out
for very expensive liability insurance to carry passengers, and will probably downgrade
much of the current P&W trackage to lower class to reduce maintenance costs.

I suppose there is an outside chance that G&W would retain the HEP unit and the
P&W hi-end coaches for use as an OCS., but that is a long shot at best...
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby johnpbarlow » Wed Oct 12, 2016 2:59 pm

That would be ironic given that CSOR depends on Amtrak rights and P&W uses many miles of rights on both MN and Amtrak. And NECR got its Vermont/NH mainline rebuilt to facilitate Vermonter High Speed Rail service. New England pols may not look kindly at GWI ending the P&W legacy of passenger excursions.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby YamaOfParadise » Wed Oct 12, 2016 3:50 pm

johnpbarlow wrote:New England pols may not look kindly at GWI ending the P&W legacy of passenger excursions.


And overall, P&W has very strong (and good) relations with the communities they go through on their wholly-owned lines. (Like through eastern CT on the Norwich Branch, and I think even along their mainline.)
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Wed Oct 12, 2016 4:32 pm

johnpbarlow wrote:
Dick H wrote:While I am not betting the farm, the days of any passenger trains on any PW/G&W
trackage will be over on the date the sale becomes final. G&W will never shell out
for very expensive liability insurance to carry passengers, and will probably downgrade
much of the current P&W trackage to lower class to reduce maintenance costs.

I suppose there is an outside chance that G&W would retain the HEP unit and the
P&W hi-end coaches for use as an OCS., but that is a long shot at best...


That would be ironic given that CSOR depends on Amtrak rights and P&W uses many miles of rights on both MN and Amtrak. And NECR got its Vermont/NH mainline rebuilt to facilitate Vermonter High Speed Rail service. New England pols may not look kindly at GWI ending the P&W legacy of passenger excursions.


It also makes no sense given that P&W's whole ops structure is reliant on having twin Class 3-rated mainlines that each dump onto the NEC at their endpoints. Their entire schedule gets thrown out the window if they can't run Worcester-Valley Falls or Worcester-Groton without accurately hitting a pair of Amtrak slots that get them reliably back home the same day. You'd be talking big capital expenditures for more yard space in RI and an entirely new engine/crew base somewhere around New London or New Haven if speeds got "Guilforded". Why do that when keeping on maintaining the mains the same way they have for the last 3+ decades ends up costing less? G&W's ruthless, but they're not stupid. They don't buy any new reporting mark without thoroughly doing their homework on what makes it tick. P&W's lean running times out of Worcester are what make the whole system map tick. Doubly so when this Canadian Gateway of theirs seeks to make itself competitive by tying together an unbroken string of Class 3-or-better St. Albans to Worcester. They're banking on their competitive niche being a paydirt of no more 1 day's transit time between CN handoff and Worcester handoff/distribution. That's not possible if every tie Northfield-Worcester and Worcester-Valley Falls is allowed to rot to splinters.

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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby Dick H » Wed Oct 12, 2016 7:18 pm

I was remiss in my previous post in not noting P&W owned trackage, versus
running over Amtrak trackage or trackage rebuilt for Amtrak operations.
Good points by F-Line.

I still doubt that there will be any passenger service between Worcester
and Providence, unless the operator assumes all the cost of further upgrades,
liability insurance, basicly relieving G&W of all responsibility, as with PAR on the
Downeaster operation, And I still think the operation of any excursion passenger
moves on P&W owned freight only lines is very unlikely.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby Rockingham Racer » Thu Oct 13, 2016 6:16 am

You might be correct on your prediction, Dick. The BSR website seems to have been taken down.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby lakest101 » Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:24 am

BSRC Website: Looks like its a server problem.
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Re: G&W to acquire P&W

Postby scratchy » Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:47 am

Rockingham Racer wrote:You might be correct on your prediction, Dick. The BSR website seems to have been taken down.


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