Arcade Sandhouse

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Arcade Sandhouse

Postby Freshwater Models » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:53 am

Hello,

Though I am new to this forum I have been a long time fan of the A&A having my first ride in 1963 in the cab of #18 with the fireman giving me a chance to stoke the fire! Over the years I have ridden the train on occassion and have explored the buildings and right of way.

As a model maker, I am interested in building a model of what some call the "sand house". To me this is a water tank with sand facility and speeder sheds attached. I have taken some pictures and measurements but still am in persuit of information on this interesting structure. I may end up producing an O and/or HO scale kit for this structure.

Does anyone have any info on the history of this building? When was it built? Did it exist in early A&A history(during narrow gauge era)? When were the two additions built/added. I am especially interested in if it was ever painted and if so what color? What happened to the water tank from inside the structure?

Inquiring minds want to know! Any insight would be much appreciated!
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Postby Benjamin Maggi » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:35 am

You are in luck! The September 1978 issue of Model Railroader actually has scale drawings for just this building! I wish they had chosen the main station to do, but they did this. The article might have a little information on the history of it, but I don't recall. Anyways, just buy the issue and it will help you. It is currently listed on ebay, if you search under "Arcade Attica." Just type those two words in and it will pop up. There are also plans for one of the bridges and the GE 44 Tonner.

Make sure to let us know how your project comes along.
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Postby Benjamin Maggi » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:37 am

And buy the way, I currently am modeling it in 1:29 Large scale, but would certainly purchase an HO kit (or maybe an O kit) should it ever be produced! And that goes double for a station kit, or even actual plans for the station. :-)
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Postby Freshwater Models » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:19 am

scoobster28 wrote:You are in luck! The September 1978 issue of Model Railroader actually has scale drawings for just this building! I wish they had chosen the main station to do, but they did this. The article might have a little information on the history of it, but I don't recall. Anyways, just buy the issue and it will help you. It is currently listed on ebay, if you search under "Arcade Attica." Just type those two words in and it will pop up. There are also plans for one of the bridges and the GE 44 Tonner.

Make sure to let us know how your project comes along.


I am hoping to borrow a copy of that issue from a friend. I will be interested in if it shows the detail I recorded and maybe some that I missed.
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Postby Freshwater Models » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:29 am

scoobster28 wrote:And buy the way, I currently am modeling it in 1:29 Large scale, but would certainly purchase an HO kit (or maybe an O kit) should it ever be produced! And that goes double for a station kit, or even actual plans for the station. :-)


Ben,

In 1:29 the sand house would be an interesting and highly detailed model :-) ! The tough part would be the spout if you model it. Gonna model the interior??? Somewhere I remember seeing an advert for a G1 GE44T but can't remember the scale :-D . THE locos to model would be #14 & #18 in live steam :P ! Though I enjoy any model I am much a fan of home brewed live steam in the smaller scales.

Regards,
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Postby Freshwater Models » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:50 am

scoobster28 wrote: And that goes double for a station kit, or even actual plans for the station. :-)


Ben,

Station plans wouldn't be tough to do though they would be time consuming! One thing to consider is just how large the model would be!!!

jack
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Postby Benjamin Maggi » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:48 pm

Freshwater,
I am a member of the Adirondack live Steamers and the thought of modeling #14 in live steam has crossed my mind. In fact, if you scan some of the old questions posted on several live steam forums, you will see me (scoobster28) asking questions about modifying an Allen Models 4-6-0.

Large scale is a bit more affordable for a grad student like me right now. I want to actually model #14, but no one makes any 1:29 steam engines that are close. The bachmann one would be more trouble than it is worth. The Aristocraft c-16 coal version can be modified with a new cab and stack to more closely resemble #18. Recently, I posted on the Aristocraft forum about this. So, steam engines are in the works. Right now, I am kitbashing 44 tonners from USA trains in #112 and #111.

I also collect any and all A&A memorabilia and have a couple of the adverts from Caterpillar on the GE engines. There is another on ebay right now that I am scanning.

I am planning on building the sandtower and engine house and station eventually, but motive power comes first.

For such a small railroad, it sure had a lot of cool stuff!
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Postby BSOR Patarak » Sun Oct 29, 2006 4:44 pm

There are two live steam versions of #14 in western New York. Joe Tanski and his father both measured 14 at Arcade and built models of it. They look excellent. Often they are on display at the Western New York Railway Historical Society's shows at the Hamburg Fairgrounds. They are painted up in Escanaba and Lake Superior paint.
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Sand House Infos

Postby BSOR Patarak » Sun Oct 29, 2006 5:00 pm

After talking with Jack about the structure, it got me looking for more info on it.

As for the term "sand house", I would speculate that it is called this in the modern era of the A&A. This "modern" era I'd say is after the coming of the diesel in 1947. Up until that time, there was a water tank and spout inside of the structure. A more accurate term at that point would have been water tower. After the diesels arrived, the tank and spout were removed. It is assumed that the next use of the building was to house and dry the traction sand. It saw other uses in the next 50 years, but probably has just always been referred to as the sand house since then.

There was a stove on the single floor south section which was used to keep the tank thawed in the winter time and later to dry the sand.

The building also saw two additions added on after that period. Exact dates are unknown. By 1950 the single floor addition off the north of the building was added. Then again around 1965 or so the garage addition to the south was put on. The garage was to house the motor cars (inspection/track cars). The structure was also utilized to house bulk salt used on deicing crossings. At somepoint between 1965 and 1975 large doors were also added to the north most addition. These may have first been added for the inspection cars. These doors were made from sheeting materials used as linings inside of the fleet of box cars the A&A used in interchange.It is interesting to note that many pieces and uses were found for these cars as they were retired. The garage portion was moved from the Lester house located on Mill Street.

The building has been used to house track cars, track materials, coach parts and steam locomotive grates and patterns. The concrete piers from the tank support still remain. There is a date of 10-22-47 and "50 Tons" written on one. I'm not sure what it signifies, but perhaps a first load of sand?

As for the date of construction, this is unknown. It is thought that it dates to the Buffalo, Attica and Arcade RR, or prior to 1917. The A&A paid $500 to the Wellsville and Buffalo for purchase of a water tank and also they moved a water spout from Crystal Lake (along the W&B) for use in 1917. The BA&A was under control of the B&S for some time and shared joint facilities with them at Arcade. The B&S had a tank standing behind the wye at Arcade to the South. This tank may have been moved for use. The BA&A may have started to use the sand house for water, but later used the B&S's. When the A&A came along and the W&B pulled up, the sand house may have been reactivated as a water tower. They definitly filled locomotives with it up into 1940. The spout disappeared by 1950 after the final steamers were replaced.

If any one else could add any details, we would sure appreciate them. Thanks,
Pat
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Sand House Info

Postby Freshwater Models » Tue May 15, 2007 1:45 pm

I will be working on the HO scale version of the "Sandhouse" in the next few weeks. At this point the one thing that perplexes me is not knowing the color the building should be painted. I haven't seen a scrap of paint on the building and haven't seen a picture that would give a clue of the color.

For those of you interested in the HO scale kit, I hope to have it on the market this Sept. or possibly earlier. It is planned as a laser cut kit since I have been working with a nice fellow who does high quality laser cutting at a very reasonable price. The design will be w/o the two additions. I hope to include Grandt Line detail parts if they have what the kit requires. I have a sample spout and am waiting on info regarding windows and door.

In addition to this project I will also be working on an HO scale version of a 65' Sellers turntable.

Regards,

Jack
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Postby Benjamin Maggi » Tue May 15, 2007 4:01 pm

Put me down for one... or maybe 2! That turntable will be great too, as I have no way to turn my 44 tonners otherwise and it sure is rough to expect my engineers to turn their heads to look out the other side!
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Postby BSOR Patarak » Sun Feb 17, 2008 11:41 am

It is very sad for me to report that the Sand House has unfortunatly met it's fate. It has been badly deteriorating the past few years. Efforts to save it move too slow. During the end of January, it was pulled down to keep it from being a safety hazard to the residents and employees. It is no more.

I hate the fact that it was not preserved. As it was mentioned about the Curriers Depot being repaired, resources have to be spent where they can and the sand house was too far out of the picture. The main shop building is in need of main roof supports and siding, and a portion of the Arcade Station is in need of repair. These later projects had to take the front burner.
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Postby Freshwater Models » Sun Feb 17, 2008 12:09 pm

It is sad to see yet another piece of history dissappear from the New York State landscape. It would have seemed that the building could have been stabilized for a pittance. I'm sure that a number of railfans would have been willing to donate time and maybe some materials It didn't help that the A&A pushed a bunch of road bed up against the structure in 2007. One can only wonder what the A&A plans to do over the next few decades. This shouldn't have happened.

Jack Mc Kie
Rochester NY
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Postby Benjamin Maggi » Sun Feb 17, 2008 1:38 pm

That is sad. However, one must put the removal of the sandhouse and the shoring up of the Curriers station in the same paragraph. With limited resources, they are doing what they can. At least we can remember the sandhouse through your models.
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Postby BSOR Patarak » Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:54 pm

I know that it should have been saved. My feelings exactly. Thats why I say the effort to save it started too late. I know that people would have come together to save it if asked or allowed to. We'll have to work harder to make sure nothing else disappears.
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