Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

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Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Tue May 12, 2009 9:29 am

What route did the BB&K take into Smethport?

According to this trail map, it took a southern route into Smethport:

Look at page 12: http://www.smethportpa.org/pdf/Smethpor ... l_book.pdf

But, using http://mapper.acme.com/ and looking at the Smethport topo map, there is an old railroad grade north of Smethport. The grade is very visible until Ormsby by switching to the satellite photos.

Is the northern grade a 3rd railroad thatw ent to Smethport?

Thanks!

Chris
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby RussNelson » Wed May 13, 2009 12:41 am

This map shows a railroad coming into Ormsby from the west and stopping there. Quite possible for it to have been extended.
http://www.rutlandtrail.org/mapview.cgi ... e=Historic
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Wed May 13, 2009 8:53 am

^Thanks, Russ. It looks like the Mt. Jewett Kinzua & Riterville did go to Smethport at one time.

Using http://mapper.acme.com/, you can still see the MtJK&R row leaving Mt Jewett.
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Wed May 13, 2009 9:54 am

This website has a BB&K map at the bottom of the page:

http://www.smethporthistory.org/w.water ... n.htm#2000

This map looks like the BB&K took the southern route into Smethport.
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Thu May 14, 2009 10:35 am

The MtJK&R was known as the Kushequa railroad. It took the northern route into Smethport.

According to these pages:

http://www.smethporthistory.org/smethpo ... train.html

http://www.smethporthistory.org/smethpo ... .depot.htm

The BB&K was abandoned into Smethport in 1904/1905. The Kushequa was abandoned into Smethport in 1927.

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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Thu May 14, 2009 10:38 am

When was the BB&K fully abandoned?

Is the book ever on eBay?
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby Aa3rt » Fri May 15, 2009 6:37 pm

According to the book Bradford, Bordell and Kinzua by Thomas Barber and James Woods, printed in 1971, the last scheduled passenger train left Bradford, bound for Kane on September 2nd, 1906.

The last train to operate over the line was an official train using locomotive #6, a combination bagggage-smoker, coach and the official car "Kinzua" ran from Bradford to Kane on the following September 15th.

Dismantling began on September 19th with locomotive #10 providing the motive power.

The official car "Kinzua" was sold to the East Broad Top where it is stil in service as their #20.
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Mon May 18, 2009 12:06 pm

Some links to the BB&K on the 'net:

Abandonment of the BB&K in September 1906:

http://www.usgennet.org/usa/ny/county/a ... unk%20Pile

A BB&K postcard:

http://railroadcollectors.org/express/s ... stcard.jpg

Page xvi of George Hilton's American narrow Gauge Railroads has a map of the BB&K:

http://books.google.com/books?id=7POj8G ... e#PPR16,M1
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Fri May 29, 2009 9:03 am

I'm getting the BB&K railroad book through New York state's inter-library loan system. It's coming from an Albany library.

I'll post when I return it to the library so someone else can request it.

I think St Bonaventure University has a copy at their library.
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby NE2 » Sun May 31, 2009 2:02 am

According to Sanborn maps, the BB&K followed Water from Hill west to Union, and then headed west about a block south of Water, with the station just east of Church. It curved to the southwest, passing just south of Hilton Avenue (then named Glass). The PS&N also used Water, apparently crossing the BB&K near Union.

The grade north of PA 59 was the Smethport Railroad, operated by the Mount Jewett, Kinzua and Riterville Railroad. It appears to have ended at a station just west of Washington, one block south of Water.

Here's a map from 1902, when all the lines were there: BB&K to Ormsby, PS&N to Kasson, and MJK&R to McKeans: http://cartweb.geography.ua.edu:9001/St ... cmd=zoomin
And a larger-scale map from 1915, after the BB&K was abandoned: ftp://ftp.dot.state.pa.us/public/pdf/BP ... n_1915.pdf

This area is almost as confusing as the anthracite fields :-D
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby Aa3rt » Sun May 31, 2009 9:33 am

NE2-Great links, especially the first one, thanks for sharing!

A good article on the region, if you can find it, appeared in the June 1963 issue of Model Railroader. Titled "Big Level: Colorado of the East" by Linn H. Wescott, the article includes a railroad map of the area, focusing on Bradford, Smethport and Eldred.

I note that thebigham has already provided some links to the Smethport history website. The home page can be reached at:

http://www.smethporthistory.org/

A couple of other links pertinent to the Bradford, Bordell and Kinzua can be found at:

http://www.smethporthistory.org/w.waterstreet/bb&kstation.htm

http://www.smethporthistory.org/w.waterstreet/bbk/bbk.to.bradford/ormsbyrr.htm
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:01 am

NE2 wrote:According to Sanborn maps, the BB&K followed Water from Hill west to Union, and then headed west about a block south of Water, with the station just east of Church. It curved to the southwest, passing just south of Hilton Avenue (then named Glass). The PS&N also used Water, apparently crossing the BB&K near Union.

The grade north of PA 59 was the Smethport Railroad, operated by the Mount Jewett, Kinzua and Riterville Railroad. It appears to have ended at a station just west of Washington, one block south of Water.

Here's a map from 1902, when all the lines were there: BB&K to Ormsby, PS&N to Kasson, and MJK&R to McKeans: http://cartweb.geography.ua.edu:9001/St ... cmd=zoomin
And a larger-scale map from 1915, after the BB&K was abandoned: ftp://ftp.dot.state.pa.us/public/pdf/BP ... n_1915.pdf

This area is almost as confusing as the anthracite fields :-D


Thanks for the maps!

So there was a line from Ormsby to Framer's Valley? Was it a lumber railroad or narrow gauge?

The 1915 map has the PS&N on the wrong side of the river from Larabee to Eldred.
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby NE2 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:30 pm

thebigham wrote:So there was a line from Ormsby to Framer's Valley? Was it a lumber railroad or narrow gauge?


That's actually McKean to Farmers Valley along the South Branch Cole Creek; the west half appears in Google Maps and on topos as an unnamed unpaved road. This was the standard-gauge Kushequa Railroad, which went from Kushequa to Farmers Valley, and was also leased by the MJK&R. Here's the page of the 1905 Official Guide with the MJK&R and BB&K, which doesn't appear to have the Farmers Valley-McKean line: http://books.google.com/books?id=nfTRqosciAsC&pg=PA357
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby NE2 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:16 am

I've transcribed the relevant parts of the ICC valuation reports. They're a little late (late 1910s) for these railroads' peak, but still have some good information.
Mount Jewett, Kinzua and Riterville
Buffalo, Bradford and Kane
Kane
Keating and Smethport
Kushequa
Mead Run
Smethport
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Re: Bradford Bordell and Kinzua RR route question

Postby thebigham » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:26 am

^Thanks!
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