RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

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RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Thu Aug 31, 2017 3:41 pm

After a month (July 27 - August 30), coal is once again running on the line between Clymer and Clearfield. Should be two 65-car trains a week (sometimes more, sometimes less). Operation is as follows:
* 130-car empty train runs from Baltimore, Md. to Keating, Pa. via NS.
* RJCP picks up train at Keating, forwards it to Clearfield, splits train in half.
* 65-car empty train runs from Clearfield to Clymer, operating over former B&O, NYC, PRR & CT&D trackage. Two engines dead in tow.
* Train arrives at Clymer, engines are shuffled around using the two towed engines, train is loaded, all engines on the front, returns to Clearfield.
* Same thing happens the following day.
* Once both loaded sets are in Clearfield, they are recombined into one 130-car train and sent to Baltimore via Keating.

14-degree curve at the base of a hill limits train length (and weight), thus two 65 car trains vs. one 130-car train.

No service on Fallentimber Branch out of Cresson in over a year now.
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Thu Aug 31, 2017 8:47 pm

Statkowski wrote:After a month (July 27 - August 30), coal is once again running on the line between Clymer and Clearfield. Should be two 65-car trains a week (sometimes more, sometimes less). Operation is as follows:
* 130-car empty train runs from Baltimore, Md. to Keating, Pa. via NS.
* RJCP picks up train at Keating, forwards it to Clearfield, splits train in half.
* 65-car empty train runs from Clearfield to Clymer, operating over former B&O, NYC, PRR & CT&D trackage. Two engines dead in tow.
* Train arrives at Clymer, engines are shuffled around using the two towed engines, train is loaded, all engines on the front, returns to Clearfield.
* Same thing happens the following day.
* Once both loaded sets are in Clearfield, they are recombined into one 130-car train and sent to Baltimore via Keating.

14-degree curve at the base of a hill limits train length (and weight), thus two 65 car trains vs. one 130-car train.

No service on Fallentimber Branch out of Cresson in over a year now.

thanks for the update, Jim S
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Thu Aug 31, 2017 9:23 pm

In case you're curious, motive power on today's Clymer-Clearfield train was as follows:
SD40-2 7123, ex-BN
SD40-2 7117, ex-BN
SD40-2 7084, ex-BN
SD40-2 3478 Snoot, ex-UP, nee-MP
SD40-2 7095, ex-BN

A while back I asked why the units were never renumbered. Apparently the FRA demands some sort of exorbitant "fee" for a railroad to renumber its own property with its own numbers. RJ Corman, ever frugal, declined the offer.
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:56 pm

Statkowski wrote:* 65-car empty train runs from Clearfield to Clymer, operating over former B&O, NYC, PRR & CT&D trackage.

How does the PRR trackage figure into all of that? I thought from Curwensville (CB Jct.) to CHerry Tree was all NYC, and then CT&D from there, but I could be missing something - there was a lot of parallel trackage.
Thanks, JS

Related, there was some talk and articles about 1-2(?) years ago about relaying the B&O from Curwensville back up to C&M Jct on the B&O (now Buffalo and Pittsburgh RR I suppose), just south of Dubois. Have you heard anything lately?
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:50 pm

Yes, Clearfield Yard to CB Junction was B&O and CB Junction to the Clearfield/Indiana County line (just below the yard) was NYC.

However, from the Clearfield/Indiana County line, past the passenger depot and through the wye was PRR (nee Cambria & Clearfield) Susquehanna Extension Branch.

At the far end of the wye, Block Limit Station "CJ", that's where the jointly owned Cherry Tree & Dixonville actually began.

The odd part of all of this is that the Cherry Tree passenger depot, clearly on Pennsylvania Railroad tracks, was owned by the Cherry Tree & Dixonville Railroad, not the Pennsylvania Railroad. The station sign, although of PRR design and lettering, did not bear the usual keystone.

The original, circa 1884, Cambria & Clearfield Railroad tracks coming up from the south used the west leg of the wye (which didn't exist at the time) and continued on for about a mile to McKeague's Mill (when the CT&D was formed this one-mile stretch became CT&D). Pop forward to circa 1905 and the Pittsburg & Eastern expands southward, coming through Burnside to meet up with the Pennsylvania and, utilizing the resources of both railroads, runs westward to access the Blacklick Coal Field. The West Branch Susquehanna River channel was moved eastward to give the Pittsburgh & Eastern land on which to build a yard, and the river also got relocated (straightened out) to permit the Cambria & Clearfield to build both a wye and trackage up to the county line, where it then continued on into the new freight yard.

Concerning the former B&O trackage, I haven't heard anything and was under the impression that had been officially abandoned. Reactivation would require a wee bit more than just putting down new rail. The former Kinport Industrial Track down to Greenwich Mine, on the other hand, is inactive, not abandoned, and would only require the addition of rail, which currently ends at the Cambria/Indiana County line. The rails are still in, although paved over, where Pa. Route 240 crosses the railroad right of way.
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:45 pm

Statkowski wrote:At the far end of the wye, Block Limit Station "CJ", that's where the jointly owned Cherry Tree & Dixonville actually began.

The odd part of all of this is that the Cherry Tree passenger depot, clearly on Pennsylvania Railroad tracks, was owned by the Cherry Tree & Dixonville Railroad, not the Pennsylvania Railroad. The station sign, although of PRR design and lettering, did not bear the usual keystone.

The original, circa 1884, Cambria & Clearfield Railroad tracks coming up from the south used the west leg of the wye (which didn't exist at the time) and continued on for about a mile to McKeague's Mill (when the CT&D was formed this one-mile stretch became CT&D). Pop forward to circa 1905 and the Pittsburg & Eastern expands southward, coming through Burnside to meet up with the Pennsylvania and, utilizing the resources of both railroads, runs westward to access the Blacklick Coal Field. The West Branch Susquehanna River channel was moved eastward to give the Pittsburgh & Eastern land on which to build a yard, and the river also got relocated (straightened out) to permit the Cambria & Clearfield to build both a wye and trackage up to the county line, where it then continued on into the new freight yard.

Fascinating. Is there a reference where is all this written down? Jim S
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:46 pm

Statkowski wrote:14-degree curve at the base of a hill limits train length (and weight), thus two 65 car trains vs. one 130-car train.

Where is this?
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:55 pm

pumpers wrote:
Statkowski wrote:14-degree curve at the base of a hill limits train length (and weight), thus two 65 car trains vs. one 130-car train.

Where is this?

I found the answer to my own question - at a web post by you it turns out, which I came across with Google: http://appalachianrailroadmodeling.com/ ... ertown-pa/

JS
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:00 pm

Much of what I've written was collected/compiled from various sources. I am indebted to the late Jeff Feldmeier for turning me into the local CT&D expert (including an article he wrote for the New York Central System Historical Society's publication).

Digging from various papers, in case you're interested, here's an outline of the line from Clearfield to Cherry Tree:

NYC – Cherry Tree Branch – Clearfield to Cherry Tree

Clearfield Yard to BR&P Jct. - New York Central RR (ex-Beech Creek RR)
BR&P Jct. (later B&O Jct.) to CB Jct. - Baltimore & Ohio RR (ex-Buffalo, Rochester & Pittsburgh RR, nee Clearfield & Mahoning Rwy.)
CB Jct. to Curry Run – New York Central RR (ex-Beech Creek Extension RR, nee Curwensville & Bower RR)
Curry Run to WJ Tower (Mahaffey) – New York Central RR (ex-Beech Creek RR)
WJ Tower to Dowler Jct. - New York Central RR (ex-Beech Creek Extension RR, nee Pittsburg & Eastern RR)
Dowler Jct. to Cherry Tree - New York Central RR (ex-Beech Extension Creek RR, nee Pittsburg & Eastern RR)

Note – Beech Creek RR was leased, Beech Creek Extension RR was owned.

Once onto the jointly-owned Cherry Tree & Dixonville, the New York Central RR once maintained a wye at Fleming Summit. The wye, not for Pennsylvania RR use, was owned by the Beech Creek Extension RR. So, not only was there a CT&D station on PRR tracks, there was a BCE wye on the CT&D.

Between the PRR & NYC overlapping one another with a multitude of branches going hither and yon, plus NYC trackage rights over assorted PRR and B&O tracks, one can't tell the players without a scorecard.
Last edited by Statkowski on Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:06 pm

Concerning my Appalachian Model Railroads articles, here's the one on Clymer: http://appalachianrailroadmodeling.com/rj-corman-at-clymer-pa/

They now run two sections of the original 130-car train from Clearfield to Clymer on two consecutive days - no more splitting at Clymer (it actually simplifies the operation). They still have to shuffle the engines around.

The Bigler Shuttle no longer operates - the mine at Stifflertown is permanently closed.
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:50 am

thanks. JS
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:13 pm

In case you're wondering why I showed the Pittsburg & Eastern as two separate entries, Mahaffey (WJ Tower) to Glen Campbell (Dowler Jct.) and then Glen Campbell (WJ Tower) to Cherry Tree, that's because the two sections of railroad were built at separate times (nine years apart) and for different purposes.

The line from Mahaffey to Glen Campbell continued on to serve the Clearfield Bituminous Coal Corporation coalfields of southeastern Clearfield County near Arcadia (the Pennsylvania Railroad's Cambria & Clearfield Railroad main line, not to be confused with the Susquehanna Extension Branch, already grabbed Glen Campbell itself, looping down on its own tracks from Mahaffey and McGee's Mills). The line from Glen Campbell (Dowler Jct.) was a later extension getting the railroad to Cherry Tree and from there go westward to access the Black Lick Coal Field.

Rather than fight one another, the two competing railroads joined to form the Cherry Tree & Dixonville Railroad, but that's another story.

Oh, you'll note that the Pittsburg & Eastern is missing the "h" from modern-day Pittsburgh. It was incorporated during the timeframe when Pittsburgh was spelled Pittsburg. In 1891, the United States Board on Geographic Names decided to drop the "h" and it wasn't until 1911 that the city got it back. The Pittsburg & Eastern was incorporated in 1895, when Pittsburgh didn't have an "h".
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Fri Sep 08, 2017 3:15 pm

Train today (Friday, Sept. 9th), first one this month, had four SD40-2s. There should be another tomorrow.

Third-hand info says there'll be ten trains this month coming out of Clymer, so that means five trains between Clearfield, Keating and Baltimore.

Only 22 days left in the month, and we've got 9 more trains at this end? Ought to be nice. Not quite as nice as when they had four or five trains a day each way coming off the CT&D, but that was way before my time.
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby pumpers » Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:55 pm

Statkowski wrote:Oh, you'll note that the Pittsburg & Eastern is missing the "h" from modern-day Pittsburgh. It was incorporated during the timeframe when Pittsburgh was spelled Pittsburg. In 1891, the United States Board on Geographic Names decided to drop the "h" and it wasn't until 1911 that the city got it back. The Pittsburg & Eastern was incorporated in 1895, when Pittsburgh didn't have an "h".

Another example is the Pittsburg and Shawmut RR.
(Statkowski, I posted a question about one of your old posts in the NYC forum a few minutes ago, in case you don't look there very often.)
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Re: RJ Corman Pennsylvania Line

Postby Statkowski » Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:00 pm

New York Central posting responded to.
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