Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY

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Re: Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY

Postby BR&P » Mon Dec 10, 2018 7:52 pm

Re: Gardenville line is clear. 12-20
Postby Matt Langworthy » Sun Jan 03, 2016 5:30 pm

I agree with you 100%. And yes, both the B&P (which owns SB) and BSOR use CP Draw regularly.


(from the thread linked to by ctclark1 10 posts above this one)

Re: Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY
New postby Matt Langworthy » Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:35 am

BSOR doesn't leave their tracks.


Letr us know when you make up your mind! :P :wink:
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Re: Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY

Postby nydepot » Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:30 pm

When you're just spouting off opinion, you don't need to make up your mind :P

Top threads now are arguments over hypotheticals. With keen insight into exactly what CSX would do and NS won't do.
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Re: Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY

Postby Matt Langworthy » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:21 am

Point of clarification- I had thought in 2016 that BSOR was using CP Draw. I subsequently discovered they do not.
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Re: Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY

Postby sd80mac » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:08 am

ctclark1 wrote:There are three drawbridges crossing Buffalo Creek, they're typically referred to by the original railroads -- Moving from Lake Erie inland, you have the New York Central (NYC) bridge (now a single track, "Main Track 3", sometimes referred to from the Conrail days as the "Compromise Branch"), the Nickel Plate RR (NKP) bridge (the currently unused bridge), and the Buffalo Creek RR (BCK) bridge (CSX Main Tracks 1 & 2, aka CP-DRAW).


Thanks. now I know the name for that 3rd one. No one mentioned to me that before.

By "they" I assume you mean CSX? Yes, they could deal with a bottleneck over the NYC bridge (being all single tracked between CP2 and CP437), and unfortunately that leaves primarily NS and B&P high and dry (since we're not sure if BS and SB use DRAW). If there was a connection built between the old B&O line and the Gardenville line (which is actually CR's Buffalo Line reroute) B&P would be free and clear to get to the Buffalo Line proper at GJ, and NS would have some major problems getting between the Southern Tier line and the Lake Erie District (see the other Gardenville/LV thread going on about weight and curvature restrictions on the Ebenezer RT) but in a pinch could make some reverse moves to switch from B&P's Buffalo Creek yard to their own (Tift Yard) with restricted speeds and lowered weight loads.


NS have 2 options. They always can use WNYPA line and cut off blocks for Bison Yard and pick up the blocks in Hornell. Other option is using trackage rights on CSX. They can get on CSX at last connection before entering buffalo and go around buffalo downtown to CP SK..

B&P... They stay on Buffalo line all the way into Buffalo, either enter into CP SK and move locos to rear of train. Then they can travel around the Buffalo downtown to go on CSX and reach NS' line at that mentioned connection. And they can do reverse move or have other locomotives waiting at switch to hook onto rear-end of train to do reverse move to BP yard by using NS-BP connection at Tift st.

There's possibility of get around but probably wont happen...
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Re: Ex-NYC Gardenville Cutoff around Buffalo NY

Postby TrainDetainer » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:11 pm

Timeline update as info - I was just reviewing ETTs and apparently Frontier was the end of anything other than local work, so last through/bypass train would have been NYC pre-Frontier. The April 1958 TT does not show the Gardenville as a main track nor any mention of GV/Gardenville - the only mention of it is the PRR crossing at GJ and a handthrown switch position at Blasdell Jct (connection to PRR WSeneca Branch). There is no mention of the former connection at BV. Prior to the end, the Gardenville is listed as main tracks 5 (Wbnd) and 6 (Ebnd) from Depew/46/WN to BV/D.
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