Single track Chicago Line?

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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Otto Vondrak » Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:58 pm

Just checking in, have we found the plans or any evidence that CSX is seriously considering single-tracking, as in the physical removal of tracks?

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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Matt Langworthy » Thu Aug 10, 2017 6:45 am

There is no hard evidence CSX plans to single track the Water Level Route.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby SecaucusJunction » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:23 am

I'm sure there are no concrete plans in place to do this, but are they trying to come up with a plan to see if it would work, I'd guess yes.
I think it may be possible that NJ Transit might not be the perfect, infallible organization that most people assume it is.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Matt Langworthy » Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:46 am

So all we have at this point is pure conjecture. Nobody can even produce a memo from CSX for a study about single tracking the line.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby jakirk » Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:57 am

I've been driving along the Chicago line for the past three years daily between Hoffmans and Utica. In this time railroad has essentially been rebuilt from the roadbed up. Brand new signal system, all new turnouts at every crossover and siding (even the out of service Kellog Industrial track in Amsterdam received a brand new turnout), new rail, including this spring, the replacement of the jointed rail on every passing siding with welded rail, major tie jobs every year, including a current job in the Fonda area, new crossing surfaces (Fonda was finished this week), and the installation of PTC, ongoing. The railroad is in arguably the best shape it's been in in decades. To rip up one main after all this investment would be madness.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Noel Weaver » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:54 pm

SecaucusJunction wrote:I'm sure there are no concrete plans in place to do this, but are they trying to come up with a plan to see if it would work, I'd guess yes.


Based on the type of traffic on the Chicago Line, my guess is a definite NO with present traffic levels, IM, Amtrak and the mix. This line is capable of providing a high standard of service, we did it on Conrail for quite some time and there is no reason that CSX can not continue to provide a high standard of service including scheduled trains over this key route with the present physical plant, reduce the trackage and the service will go downhill badly. I hope the powers to be care enough to provide a decent level of service to all customers, Amtrak, UPS, JB Hunt, Schneider and the regular users of bulk freight operators as well.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby tree68 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:32 pm

Noel Weaver wrote:I hope the powers to be care enough to provide a decent level of service to all customers, ...

Only if they can make money on their CSX stock from it in the process.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby SecaucusJunction » Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:34 am

I would assume that if, somehow, they were able to accomplish this, one track would stay CSX and one would go to Amtrak through NY State.




Noel Weaver wrote:
SecaucusJunction wrote:I'm sure there are no concrete plans in place to do this, but are they trying to come up with a plan to see if it would work, I'd guess yes.


Based on the type of traffic on the Chicago Line, my guess is a definite NO with present traffic levels, IM, Amtrak and the mix. This line is capable of providing a high standard of service, we did it on Conrail for quite some time and there is no reason that CSX can not continue to provide a high standard of service including scheduled trains over this key route with the present physical plant, reduce the trackage and the service will go downhill badly. I hope the powers to be care enough to provide a decent level of service to all customers, Amtrak, UPS, JB Hunt, Schneider and the regular users of bulk freight operators as well.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Noel Weaver » Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:21 pm

SecaucusJunction wrote:I would assume that if, somehow, they were able to accomplish this, one track would stay CSX and one would go to Amtrak through NY State.
Doing this would not improve the operation for either CSX or for Amtrak. Single track with sidings for Amtrak means one late train adds to more late trains. For freight it means not making their schedule and for shippers like UPS, that is very, very important.
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Noel Weaver wrote:
SecaucusJunction wrote:I'm sure there are no concrete plans in place to do this, but are they trying to come up with a plan to see if it would work, I'd guess yes.


Based on the type of traffic on the Chicago Line, my guess is a definite NO with present traffic levels, IM, Amtrak and the mix. This line is capable of providing a high standard of service, we did it on Conrail for quite some time and there is no reason that CSX can not continue to provide a high standard of service including scheduled trains over this key route with the present physical plant, reduce the trackage and the service will go downhill badly. I hope the powers to be care enough to provide a decent level of service to all customers, Amtrak, UPS, JB Hunt, Schneider and the regular users of bulk freight operators as well.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Otto Vondrak » Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:01 pm

So just checking, has CSX revealed their plans to single-track the railroad?

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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby Train60 » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:01 am

This recent article by Fred Frailey provides some interesting insight in to this discussion.
http://cs.trains.com/trn/b/fred-frailey/archive/2017/08/13/single-track-the-water-level-route.aspx
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby johnpbarlow » Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:42 am

Otto Vondrak wrote:So just checking, has CSX revealed their plans to single-track the railroad?

-otto-


Fred Frailey asserts that CSX has thought about it but no details of CSX thinking have been revealed:
CSX has been studying the feasibility of single-tracking its route from Chicago to Selkirk (Albany), N.Y...Latest word is that the single-tracking idea has been put on hold. Maybe that’s just as well.


His article is a very interesting simulation and analysis (and he probably didn't charge EHH millions of $ for the study!). Barring unforeseen freight (or passenger) traffic growth, my opinion is this proposal may have merit a few more years down the road (eg, after autonomous driving trucks hit the interstate highways in the Northeast US).
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby DogBert » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:50 am

johnpbarlow wrote:
Otto Vondrak wrote:So just checking, has CSX revealed their plans to single-track the railroad?

-otto-


Fred Frailey asserts that CSX has thought about it but no details of CSX thinking have been revealed:
CSX has been studying the feasibility of single-tracking its route from Chicago to Selkirk (Albany), N.Y...Latest word is that the single-tracking idea has been put on hold. Maybe that’s just as well.


His article is a very interesting simulation and analysis (and he probably didn't charge EHH millions of $ for the study!). Barring unforeseen freight (or passenger) traffic growth, my opinion is this proposal may have merit a few more years down the road (eg, after autonomous driving trucks hit the interstate highways in the Northeast US).


Honestly don't think we're going to see autonomous trucks anytime in our lifetime, at least in the northeast. Also doubt trucking companies would want to reduce rates a penny even with reduced labor.
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Re: Single track Chicago Line?

Postby sd80mac » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:37 am

Otto Vondrak wrote:So just checking, has CSX revealed their plans to single-track the railroad?

-otto-


I think that you're confused... CSX is trying to return to the hey days.. 4 tracks... Rumors says so.. :P :P :P :P
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