Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris County

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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby NYSW2300 » Wed Jul 12, 2017 8:53 am

brwfan wrote:After a little research it seems like m&e weighed the cars on a scale track at Port Morris. Drrr still doesn't have trackage rights on njt afaik so not sure how they are.


If its that much of an issue the NS could weigh it at Port Morris too. I don't think this is a big of an issue. Most humps have scales built into them. Also depending on the type of scrap getting loaded, the car might not be close at all to getting overloaded.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby bk77 » Sat Jul 15, 2017 10:24 am

Did a third engine ever make it out to the DRRV? Last I read a few weeks ago the one coming up from Fairless PA developed a hot box and got sidelined.... haven't heard anything since.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby brwfan » Sat Jul 15, 2017 1:20 pm

As of yesterday 915 was still sitting in alburtis pa
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby NYS&W142Fan » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:53 pm

Well it's been over two weeks now, any Photos of the new operators?
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby blockline4180 » Fri Jul 21, 2017 6:01 am

NYS&W142Fan wrote:Well it's been over two weeks now, any Photos of the new operators?


There are photos in facebook groups of a few of the black engines working the branch lines. I believe SW1500.
A third ex W&W blue SW900 was supposed to join them, but had brake or wheel issues enroute. Dont know if its still coming.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby blockline4180 » Fri Jul 21, 2017 6:05 am

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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby NYS&W142Fan » Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:08 am

Thank you blockline4180!
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby bk77 » Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:48 pm

I recall reading back when the county lines changed operators the M&E stated they would work with the D&RR with getting them CSAO traffic from Harrison. Curious, has that been happening or has the D&RR only been interchanging with NS so far?

Haven't really seen any updates otherwise regarding the D&RR. I assume everything has been more or less "status quo"?
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby Eric S Strohmeyer » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:50 pm

Good evening folks,

I wanted to respond to BK77's question. He said:

I recall reading back when the county lines changed operators the M&E stated they would work with the D&RR with getting them CSAO traffic from Harrison. Curious, has that been happening or has the D&RR only been interchanging with NS so far?


Based upon certain key "evidence", the answer to your question appears to be "NO" ...... I too was curious about the amazing (read: unbelievable) "public disclaimer" made by Morris County officials during the course of the STB proceedings. My gut seemed to say to me that the self-serving proclamation was made because there was concern that shippers might rightfully "object" at the STB regarding the loss of competitive rail access. Such a protest or objection would likely have delayed the takeover, or complicated the regulatory proceeding.

Turning to the primary evidence which supports my position that the public declarations were/are not accurate, one need only look at both of the websites for the D&RR and the M&E to realize that there is likely no agreement for the M&E to haul CSX-bound bridge traffic to Lake Junction.

While the M&E website touts its dual competitive access (NS/CSX), there is NO mention at all of any ability to connect to the D&RR at Lake Junction, or to act as a "bridge carrier" for other Morris County shippers.

When one looks at the D&RR website, there is NO mention of being able to bridge traffic to CSX through the M&E. The D&RR website lists their sole connection as the NS.

I would like to remind everyone of what Mr. Vitz claimed earlier in this thread was one of Morris County's main justification for switching operators. He said:

The review committee (two employees that oversee the railroad operation and one from another division) felt the new operator has offered some innovative ideas to market the lines to retain and hopefully attract new business.


Obviously, making it clear to potential shippers that industrial sites in Morris County have access to competitive rail service is NOT an innovative idea to market the line for attracting new business. So, it would appear that all the industrial sites located in northwest Morris County will remain competitively disadvantaged.

I do not mean to sound particularly harsh with my criticism, but I feel that the County should have carefully weighed access to competitive rail connections more carefully when it made its decision. The County also should have consulted with its own railroad attorneys on how best to have preserved competitive access before it made a decision which might have closed off a competitive gateway.

It is my sincere hope that Morris County will make it clear to both carriers (M&E / D&RR) that they need to work together to make as many industrial sites as possible in Morris County competitive with those industrial sites located adjacent to the CSAO area, NYS&W, Raritan Central, NYNJ Rail, etc..... That begins by PUBLICLY advertising competitive access routings.

The only reason one would NOT advertise such a routing would be if such routing were no longer possible. This glaring public omission by both the M&E and the D&RR forms the basis for my belief that the closure of competitive access did, in fact, occur when the M&E lost their operating contract. Given the fact that no photos have emerged of an M&E "bridge line" train, nor any report of overhead traffic spoken off, nor any public acknowledgement of, or advertising of, any type of competitive access routing, I respectfully submit my evidence to support my position that there is no agreement to allow the M&E to bridge traffic to the former County lines and this critical publicly owned asset just became captive because of a serious mistake made by those officials who failed to properly consider and protect the competitive rail access to their property.

Just my two cents... but given the strong evidence, competitive rail access in Morris County clearly appears to be now limited to just the Whippany line. I would be gratefully surprised to be proven wrong....
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby ccutler » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:06 am

Has traffic on the new BR&W-run lines increased or decreased since they took over Morris County's lines? I see the new scrap shipper, which looks promising. Also, given CSX's change in priorities away from serving customers, it may be that the lack of CSX access isn't making much difference.
I hope M&E management has it's business strategy in shape. They've lost so much of their business in the last few years that it raises some concerns.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby brwfan » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:42 pm

Not to get off topic but m+e has njt upgrades at their shop. They are putting a new building up for that. They are also building 2 sidings for car storage off Fredrick place.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby CR7876 » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:01 pm

From July to December the DRRV moved 186 inbound loads, 14 outbound loads, and 4 inbound empty's waiting to be loaded, for a total of 204 cars.

Of these cars 8 loads of Gypsum Wallboard were originated on CSX, all in the Pittsburg, PA area. Instead of being routed from the south to Selkirk and then back to North Bergen/South Kearney ( the CSX interchange is via South Kearney and South Kearney is not served via Oak Island) and then Via the M&E, the routing was CSX-Hagerstown-NS. 3 cars of plastic were originated at the Phillips 66 storage on the RCRY, those cars were routed NS OI-ATown.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby ccutler » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:43 am

Thanks CR7876 for the traffic data.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby blockline4180 » Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:59 pm

brwfan wrote:Not to get off topic but m+e has njt upgrades at their shop. They are putting a new building up for that. They are also building 2 sidings for car storage off Fredrick place.


When you mean off Frederick Place are you talking about west of the Frederick Place crossing or east, or both?? I'm just wondering to see if it will be in 2 sections or if it will go across the road. Not a big deal, just curious.

And to get back on topic, M&E does on a occasion go to Lake Junction to pick up the storage cars and/or for the few customers that are left on the Whippany Line... It's not frequent, but it has happened a few times.. This leads me to believe CSX had a hand in this and had either increased rates to make it prohibitive to move stuff that way, or there were just other factors which made the dwell time longer.
Also, the long term plan ( was suppose to be last year) was that the D&RRV was going to take over NS H02 traffic ops and bring the cars to Lake Junction themselves for the one customer in Dover and the Totowa Spur, but that remains it be seen if it will happen anytime soon.
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Re: Black River & W. affiliate to replace M&E ops Morris Cou

Postby brwfan » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:51 pm

I'm not sure which way is which but it's on the same side as abc supply. One siding on each side of the tracks. If you go on Google Street view one of our trucks is dropping off fill dirt. That's going to be the shorter one. I was told 1500 ft and 700 ft long respectively
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