Number 38 Tender

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Number 38 Tender

Postby jrs363 » Mon Dec 03, 2007 4:04 pm

Steam loco number 38 had a PRR tender according yo lalrailfan.net. Anyone know what type of locomotive it was used on?
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Postby TB Diamond » Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:48 pm

jrs:

Are you speaking of the origional tender that came with number 38 from Rail City? If so, this was removed after 38 arrived at Lakeville as it was totally rusted out. It was replaced with the tender that was on number 17. Both 17 and the origional tender from 38 were then scrapped.
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Postby jrs363 » Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:49 pm

My uderstanding is that 17 had its tender replaced with a PRR tender, so the the one that went to 38 from 17 was the PRR.

I guess if someone knew enough about PRR tenders you could tell from a later picture.
Last edited by jrs363 on Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby jrs363 » Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:01 pm

This should help:


Image
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Postby EMTRailfan » Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:39 am

Check here: http://railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42485 for info on #38 and the tender, and then follow that post to the PA forums to read the Kane newspaper article on the Knox&Kane possibly running excursions in 2008. It is toward the bottom of page 1 now. It is my understanding that #38 went through a "voluntary" rebuild just before the FRA made them manditory. My speculation only is there shouldn't be anything that needs done to her other than inspecting her again. Maybe we'll see her in action in 2008???

I was given access inside the roundhouse in Marienville in Sept 2006 and I have a very poor quality photo of #38's tender if it would help. (really dark with a P&S) I just figured out how to post pics from other sites, thanks to Luther, but I don't know how to post from my hard drive if it is possible. The pic is not worthy of a web site post :( I will email it to anyone of they are interested. Both steamers are now stored in Kane. I missed them getting tugged from Marienville. Although not under steam, it would have still been awesome to see them rolling down the line.
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Postby Otto Vondrak » Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:07 am

You cannot post photos from your hard drive. They must be uploaded to a free site like Webshots or Photobucket. See the Help Forum for more details.

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Postby Luther Brefo » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:28 pm

EMTRailfan wrote:I was given access inside the roundhouse in Marienville in Sept 2006 and I have a very poor quality photo of #38's tender if it would help. (really dark with a P&S) I just figured out how to post pics from other sites, thanks to Luther, but I don't know how to post from my hard drive if it is possible.


If you want to try it yourself, here are some instructions, otherwise send it to me and I can host it for you.

First, create and account on PhotoBucket, then

"To upload an image:

1. Log into your Photobucket account.
2. Click the 'images from my PC' tab at the top of the Upload Panel. The tab will be labeled 'images from my Mac' for Macintosh users.
3. Click a 'Browse' button and select an image from your computer.
4. You may add a Title for the image in the box below the image file name (optional).
5. Click the 'Upload' button.

When the image upload has successfully completed, you will be placed in the image tagging screen. Tags, titles and descriptions can be added or modified from this page. This process can be skipped for the current upload or the option can be turned off/on for all uploads within the upload ‘options’.

Once this process is completed, the image will appear in the thumbnail size in the album."

From http://photobucket.com/faq?catID=43&cat ... opicID=369
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Postby Luther Brefo » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:33 pm

Looks like a Pennsy 70F70... Visual proof here: http://prr.railfan.net/diagrams/Tenders ... 70f70c.gif

And here it is on an H9s. but the 70F70 is listed as 70F70a. The a could be a revision mark. I don't know steam, I don't know the Pennsy too well, but I can use the internet. http://prr.railfan.net/diagrams/Steam// ... E45442.gif

Well, there you have it.
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Postby TB Diamond » Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:26 pm

Anyone know why the BC&G engine wound up with a PRR tender before being sold off the property? Should be an interesting story.
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Postby EMTRailfan » Wed Dec 05, 2007 5:38 pm

I uploaded my tender shot from the Knox and Kane into the Yahoo group. Hoping the link works to there. Here it is (hopefully).

**Edit-posting the photo did not work to Yahoo, but the link worked for me not being logged in if you are not a member. like I said, the photo sucks.

http://us.a2.yahoofs.com/groups/g_28056 ... HBs_D0R_CW
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Postby Lehighton_Man » Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:08 pm

wait, the LAL had a steamer?
was this before it was a regional shortline?
I am curious to know this!!
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Postby TB Diamond » Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:52 pm

lehighton:

That is correct. The LA&L began in 1964 when that portion of the former Erie Rochester branch Avon-Livonia plus a spur Conesus Jct.-Lakeville was purchased from the E-L, the money being raised by public stock subscription. First power was a GE 45-ton followed shortly by a GE 44-ton. The 45-ton was then sold. The first LA&L steam locomotive was ex-Buffalo Creek & Gauley no. 17 which arrived during the summer of 1965. I believe that the first full season of service for no. 17 was 1966. I can recall hearing this engine whistling for the Stone Hill Road crossing from my home in Lakeville that summer. Unfortunately, no. 17 developed some severe boiler problems and was replaced by ex-HB&T no. 38 which was purchased from Rail City, I believe in late 1967 or early 1968. No. 38 was sold to the Gettysburg tourist railroad and was shipped out in August, 1977. Alco RS1 no. 20 finished out LA&L passenger service which ended, If recall is correct, on 31 October 1976.

Information is from ERIE RAILROAD (ROCHESTER DIVISION) by Bill Gordon and from personal notes/photo files. Will honor all corrections/additions to this post.
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Correction

Postby Matt Langworthy » Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:12 pm

TB Diamond wrote:lehighton:
Alco RS1 no. 20 finished out LA&L passenger service which ended, If recall is correct, on 31 October 1976.


LAL ended excursion service in 1977. This is confirmed by LAL's website, and yours truly- who rode the LAL passenger train for the second and final time that summer.
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Postby TB Diamond » Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:21 pm

Matt:

Thank you for the correction. Had recall that the LA&L passenger service was to end in 1976 account probems finding proper insurance. My photo notes stated that the last train was on 31 Oct. 1976. Had no mention of LA&L passenger service in my files for 1977. Now that you mentioned it, I do recall that service was to start up in 1977 but never got down to Livonia to confirm it. Do you happen to recall the date of the final trip?
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Number 38 Tender

Postby blabey » Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:24 am

I may be able to add to the information that's been posted regarding the tender used on LAL steam power. It's true that both No. 17 (the ex-Elk River Coal & Lumber 2-8-2) and No. 38 (the ex-Huntington & Broad Top Mt. 2-8-0) used a tender from a scrapped PRR H9. We bought that tender after it was declared surplus. I think it had been saved for service as a work train water car.

The original tenders on both of the LAL steamers were shot and not worth repairing.

Like her tender, No. 17 was pretty well worn out when we bought her. She had been used to push cars to a "gob pile" at the Widen mine. Unlike the power on the affiliated Buffalo Creek & Gauley, No. 38 and a sister 2-8-2 that Elk River had bought from the Savannah & Atlanta weren't given much maintenance. Things like routine boiler washes were apparently few and far between. It seems they were considered "expendable" by management. As a result, the firebox and mud rings were in bad shape.

Although we had her patched up as well possible by the crew at the BC&G shop, it was essentially a lost cause. Although No. 17 inaugurated steam excursion service between Livonia and Avon we had continual problems. In the end, the expert advice we got was that it wouldn't be worth spending additional money to keep her running.

That's when No. 38, a static display at Rail City Museum at Sandy Pond, NY, came into the picture. We had her trucked down to Lakeville where we did some of the restoration work. Later we sent her to Hornell.
This Baldwin 2-8-0 was (and is) a good example of a typical shortline locomotive. Indeed, we often used her as God intended on mixed trains during July and August. She even hauled some freight trains. However, the economics of the steam excursion business in a non-destination tourist area are dicey at best, and when you add the exponential increases in insurance on passenger trains, it didn't make sense for us to continue in that business. So we sold the 38 to Sloan Cornell for use on his Knox and Kane RR. She remains on the K&K.

As an aside, No. 38 had some notable "last runs" in her long career. She ran an NRHS excursion from Syracuse to Sandy Pond before going on display at the now-closed museum there - that was the last time steam ran on the Penn Central's St. Lawrence Division. No. 38 was also the last steam locomotive to have heavy repairs done at the E-L's Hornell erecting shop. I have a couple of photos of No. 38 with her boiler lifted off the frame by the overhead cranes at Hornell.

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