The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Discussion about RDC's, "doodlebugs," gas-electrics, etc.

Re: RDCs

Postby madcrow » Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:11 pm

F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:
caduceus wrote:It does still seem as if something at the federal level needs to be done to make DMUs a viable option.


You mean, like a common design that takes the best elements of other cars, which runs reliably with off-the-shelf parts, and which can be produced and adapted by multiple manufacturers and sold cheaply?

Maybe they should convene a Presidents' Committee and get on that. :wink:

The first thing they should do is tell the FRA to stop holding DMUs to the same standard as locomotives. Then they can get down to creating the 21st century PCC ;)
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Re: RDCs

Postby R36 Combine Coach » Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:50 pm

A all-purpose interurban vehicle, capable of running on Class I (grade-separated) main lines and street-running transit lines could do the trick.

As for FRA regs, I believe that anything self-propelled and running on rails should be FRA class. It's ridiculous to have transit cars exempt from such standards, even when they run on streets and share the right-of-way with vehicles and pedestrians (which makes them even more important to regulate for safety).
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Re: RDCs

Postby DutchRailnut » Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:51 am

madcrow wrote:The first thing they should do is tell the FRA to stop holding DMUs to the same standard as locomotives. Then they can get down to creating the 21st century PCC ;)



Right lets give up safety so rail roads can break the law a little more.
A RDC has been a locomotive since its inception,for anything to travel on US rail network the car/locomottive has to conform to minimal federal standards.
The European DMU does not fit in with 200 ton locomotives and 150 ton freight cars, this is not Europe toy tran network with freight cars of max 80 ton and locomotives of 90 ton max.
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Re: RDCs

Postby Ridgefielder » Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:47 pm

Dutch is right- the European systems have much smaller and lighter rolling stock-- plus they haul nowhere near as much freight. Seems to me it makes more sense to look at Russia, Australia and South Africa-- all of which seem to operate with equipment much closer to US standards in terms of weight and size (and yes I know that SA would be considered narrow-guage in North America!).

Is there much use of DMUs on any of those systems? Anyone know?
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Re: RDCs

Postby Otto Vondrak » Thu Nov 19, 2009 2:54 pm

This doesn't seem to be a discussion related to just Boston, but about DMU's in general, so I'm moving this thread to the Self-Propelled Forum (the forum that goes all by itself)...
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Re: The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Postby MBTA3247 » Thu Nov 19, 2009 3:37 pm

*groans at Otto's pun*
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Re: The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Postby mtuandrew » Fri Nov 20, 2009 1:10 am

Most other countries have begun to move away from the DMU-EMU design, to trains with an integrated power car on each end but without powered axles in the consist. Since the United States rail system is usually entirely contrary to those around the world, now would be the perfect time to make new RDCs. :-D
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Re: The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Postby DutchRailnut » Fri Nov 20, 2009 9:26 pm

Would not be first time we do Ass Backwards, after all other countries are trying to privatize railroads, US is trying to slowly nationalize railroads.
Britain is sorry it privatized so commuter agencies go with same loosers that failed in France and Britain ???
go figure ?????????????????????????????
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Re: The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Postby electricron » Sat Nov 21, 2009 2:19 am

It's true CRC is not coming back. But US Railcar bought all CRC equipment and designs. US Railcar has asked for stimulus funds to build a new factory so they can build more of these FRA compliant DMUs.

SMART is readying a RFP to buy FRA compliant DMUs. They think there may be four vendors bidding on it, including Siemens and Nippon Sharyo.

European non-compliant DMUs on order or in service today in America are:
(A) NJT River Run (20) Stadler GTWs, (B) NCTD Sprinter (12) Siemens Desiros (C) CapMetro (6) Stadler GTWs, (D) DCTA (11) Stadler GTWs.

By the way, DART has (13) Budd RDCs in service today. DART, DCTA, and Stadler are talking with the FRA to get Stadler GTWs and FLIRTS into an Alternate FRA compliant vehicle. I have no idea if they will be successful or not. But DART and DCTA feel the talks are going well with the FRA so far. Whereas Stadler builds GTWs to a modular design, they appear willing to customize.

DCTA GTW (DMU for standard gage)
Image

SNC-Lavalin GTW for Puy-de-Dôme (EMU for rack railway)
Image

I doubt the Puy-de-Dome version could ever be FRA compliant, but it does look good and backs up that Stadler is one European vendor willing to customize.

Additionally, the GTW can come with a DMU or EMU power module.
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Re: The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Postby atsf sp » Mon Nov 23, 2009 5:37 pm

But the truth is this proposal will not flourish into any order soon. The DMUs are proposed for operation once the new Brighton/Allston stations are built and the CSX line between Boston and Framingham are fully transfered to the MBTA. That is at least 10 years as currently projected. Plus the MBTA is bankrupt and first needs to procur replacement engines for their aging F40 and GP40 fleet.
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Re: The next-generation RDC for Boston?

Postby keyboardkat » Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:04 pm

The European DMUs shown (like the Stadtler) would need to be adapted to high-level platforms for service in the NY area.
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